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Thread: Wait . . . What did Gardy just say?

  1. #21
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iTwins View Post
    Don't disparage the guys in the minors to defend your starter. Most fans are too smart to fall for that and it just comes off as an excuse.
    This. We all know May is on a 26-inning scoreless streak and Johnson is running neck and neck with him. So just give Correia the company line vote of confidence and change the subject already.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  2. #22
    Senior Member All-Star Boom Boom's Avatar
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    If Gardy says the reason Correia is staying in the rotation is the money he's making, it almost sounds like he'd make the move if he could but the FO is forcing him to keep running out Correia.

    The manager really shouldn't care one way or another about how much money a guy's making. All the manager should worry about is winning games.

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  4. #23
    Senior Member All-Star Hosken Bombo Disco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nicksaviking View Post
    I do hate the implication that Correia has to play because they paid him too much. He's the flipping on field manager, he's supposed to want the best players and not give two #$& about money.

    I further am opposed to this line: "The guys in Triple-A have had their ups and downs, too. They’ve had some good starts and bad starts, and believe me, we know where they’re at.”

    Is he seriously trying to compare Correia's struggles to minor hiccups May, Meyer, Johnson and Darnell have had?

    I agree with the above posters who say Gardy shouldn't be expected to rip Correia in public, however while he's defending him he throws the AAA guys under the bus? What the hell?

    Edit: Sorry for the plagiarism iTwins, I promise your post wasn't up when I started typing mine!
    Maybe he's giving them long-distance preparation for the big leagues??

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  6. #24
    Senior Member All-Star Hosken Bombo Disco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike wants wins View Post
    "mediocre" now means awful? Let's just be honest here, he's awful at his job. Not an awful person, not an awful teammate, but at his job. He's not mediocre.
    And he's lived the dream as a big league ball player for going on a decade. If he was released this afternoon, he has nothing to hang his head about. (Could and should be said for a half dozen other guys on the 25 man, too.)

  7. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by iTwins View Post
    That may be what he's trying to do, but I don't know if it's necessary. I'd like to think most fans know well enough than to expect a rookie to come out of the gate and look like Jose Fernandez. (I'll readily admit, I could be wrong here. I sometimes give other fans credit for being smarter than they really are)
    I think fans way overrate prospects in general. Some are worthy of praise - Meyer, Sano, Buxton. But guys like May, Pinto, Darnell, Johnson are not even in most lists of the Twins best 10 prospects and Pinto and Johnson are career journeymen. I like them both (b/c I love all prospects) and hope that Pinto gets up here. But I do think that most fans expectations for any of these guys is out of line with the reality of what will happen - come up, get knocked around, struggle, get sent back down, repeat a few times. If you recall, a few years ago, Dozier was this really intriguing sleeper that a lot of us liked. Then he sucked and we couldn't get rid of him fast enough. Same with Perkins and Plouffe and Parmelee. If you look at our draft threads you see fans comparing prospects to HOFers and vomitting at the thought of having to get another Brad Radke.

    Fans love unseen prospects like they love the back up QB.

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  9. #26
    Senior Member All-Star Hosken Bombo Disco's Avatar
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    I do agree, this is just Gardy being Gardy, shootin' from the hip. It's fun when we're winning and it misfires when losing.

  10. #27
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    So the sooner they are up, the sooner they can adjust and contribute, I would think. I do agree that fans over rate prospects, but it it's impossible to be worse than the worst.....

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  12. #28
    Senior Member Double-A zenser's Avatar
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    Yes the guys in AAA have had ups and downs. Yes Correia has had his ups and downs (mainly downs this year). The difference between the two is that guys in AAA have a future in Minnesota, Correia does not. He is not going to be worth anything more than a broken bat and maybe a scuffed up ball at the deadline so why wait until then?

  13. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by gunnarthor View Post
    What did you want Gardy to say? "I want Meyer up here but the FO isn't ready for that."? He's towing the company line for now. Correia has a little more rope than Pelfrey but probably not a lot more (interestingly, if you trust fip, Correia has been extremely unlucky this year).
    I am sure once Correia's FIP luck evens out, he will be right back to being the career 85 ERA+ starter he was entering the season!

    You have to admit, the way Gardy invoked Correia's salary was really weird. "He's paid good money to do that" is a pretty common saying in sports, and can have positive type connotations, but "he's going to get paid no matter what" is a little odd.

  14. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by nicksaviking View Post
    I further am opposed to this line: "The guys in Triple-A have had their ups and downs, too. They’ve had some good starts and bad starts, and believe me, we know where they’re at.”

    Is he seriously trying to compare Correia's struggles to minor hiccups May, Meyer, Johnson and Darnell have had?
    To be fair, when Johnson came up for a spot start, he threw 106 pitches in 4.1 innings, walked 6 dudes and gave up four more hits ... He was about as lucky as Correia has been unlucky (not defending Correia in the least) to not give up any runs .... He didn't do the job that needed to be done at the time -- give the bullpen a break. Fortunately, Nolasco came out the next day and went the distance in a loss. I think that gives a little more credibility to Gardy saying ~ we know where they're at.

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  16. #31
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    I always like how the Twins like to say a player needs to be more consistent when they really mean he has to be better. I think Correia has been pretty consistent this year. If he got more consistent, he'd probably have an ERA around 8 or so.

  17. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boom Boom View Post
    If Gardy says the reason Correia is staying in the rotation is the money he's making, it almost sounds like he'd make the move if he could but the FO is forcing him to keep running out Correia.

    The manager really shouldn't care one way or another about how much money a guy's making. All the manager should worry about is winning games.
    On second glance, I thought this too. (Could also just be Gardy rambling and saying nothing at all, of course.)

  18. #33
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
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    "He's paid good money to do that" sounds like an indictment of the FO, when that means putting meatballs on a "T". Maybe it's his way of touting the company line with a tinge of sarcasm.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  19. #34
    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike wants wins View Post
    Embarrassing .......and unjustifiable. Worst starter in the majors, and they have guys dominating AAA, and he stays up here.....ya, they are really trying hard to win this year.
    I wan't May/Meyer up as much as anyone, but please, let's cut down on the hyperbole. Neither May or Meyer are "dominating" AAA, both look great, but both have some red flags still.

    Correia, though frustrating actually had put together 3 solid games prior to last night. I'm guessing if he has a significant slide again (3 out of 4 bad starts) he will be gone.
    "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take"- L. Harvey Oswald


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  21. #35
    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gunnarthor View Post
    I don't think he's trying to disparage May, for instance. I think he's trying to keep our expectations honest. May has had some really good outings but has had some issues with walks and has been able to get minor league hitters to chase a bit. When he gets up here, he's probably going to get knocked around and sent back down before he figures it out long term. But I think a lot of people see his sub 3.00 era and more strike outs than innings pitched and think he's a front of the rotation starter.

    I guess I just don't read his comment the same way as you did.
    Agreed, also I think he was saying that in response to all the writers/bloggers/fans clamoring up and down for May/Meyer up RIGHT NOW. Additionally, he is right, they have been up and down.
    "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take"- L. Harvey Oswald


  22. #36
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    Thirty straight innings without an earned run is not dominating? Worst ERA in baseball is not bad enough for you for him to be considered bad?

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  24. #37
    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gunnarthor View Post
    Fans love unseen prospects like they love the back up QB.
    I was seriously about to do a response stating this but saw that you beat me too it.
    "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take"- L. Harvey Oswald


  25. #38
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    I struggle to define "dominating" if May's last two months are not that. Perhaps you could help?

  26. #39
    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike wants wins View Post
    Thirty straight innings without an earned run is not dominating? Worst ERA in baseball is not bad enough for you for him to be considered bad?
    Yes, those were a really nice 4 games, fueled somewhat but a lucky .219 BABIP. He also has had some bad starts, and still is walking too many folks in some of his games. Gardy is right, he has been up and down.

    Don't get me wrong, I have high hopes for May, but he isn't exactly a can't miss guy, and I could see his BB issues biting him big time in the ass in the majors where hitters are much more patient.
    "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take"- L. Harvey Oswald


  27. #40
    Kevin Coreia is not tradeable right now. He has not pitched well enough for any other team to say "Hey, we need that guy". If he was pitching well enough, the Twins would have no reason to trade him in the first place.

    Keep in mind other teams have minor league systems as well. They would most likely try to go through their own minor leaguers before looking at an outside player. After the other teams have gone through their minor league backups, then we will see the trade rumors float about. That probably won't happen until closer to the trade deadline.

    Another thing holding the Twins from making a move is their own promotion system. In the past, the Twins have made system promotions near the midway point of the season and near the end of the season. The Twins usually wait until closer to the all star games before making the first promotions. They will want to allow any of their minor leaguers to make their all star games if they are named. The end of the year promotions will also depend upon the playoff situations of their teams.

    So unless an injury occurs to Coreia, he is in the rotation until the around the all star game or trade deadline at the earliest and the September call up period at the latest.

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