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Thread: Don't Look Now but the Transformation has Begun

  1. #21
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    The Nationals are all out of love for Span. Way too inconsistent (5 for 5 one night, 3 for 25 the next five nights) with a low on-base percentage. Problem is they need infield help which the Twins do not have a surplus of. Plus, if I remember right, Span is due a lot of money next year.

  2. #22
    Senior Member All-Star JB_Iowa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dave View Post
    The Nationals are all out of love for Span. Way too inconsistent (5 for 5 one night, 3 for 25 the next five nights) with a low on-base percentage. Problem is they need infield help which the Twins do not have a surplus of. Plus, if I remember right, Span is due a lot of money next year.
    You are right. There's a $9 million club option with a $.5 million buyout.

    Pretty general consensus is that the option won't be exercised.

  3. #23
    I think we can have a nice serviceable cf combo of Fuld vs righties and Hicks vs lefties. Which means Kubel should be DFA. Left field Willingham/Parms/Nuenez combo.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
    I agree that's likely where Deduno ends up given his age and stuff but he has continually defied the odds as a pitcher. As long as he's producing, he should continue to get chances to start. So far, he has been an adequate back of the rotation guy for the Twins and IMO, should continue to get opportunities to fill that role until he is no longer capable of doing so or is traded.

    I don't think FIP and xFIP are good markers for Deduno. He has continually shown the ability to induce weak contact and is therefore punished by those statistics.
    I agree he's an adequate back-end starter. That's only a commodity in the eyes of shell shocked Twins fans. I'm not in a hurry to remove him from the rotation either, since Correia is still in it... but if a young player earns a shot, Deduno shouldn't be an impediment. That would make no sense for the future of the club.

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  6. #25
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
    Eh, on a Jim Thome-type deal it's not a bad flyer.

    Though it's unlikely Josh is going to accept that deal.
    Sure, if you want to extend the definition of extension to include "ridiculously low wage, one year deals" I could probably entertain the idea. But I don't find that remotely plausible and anything other than that is a horrible idea.

  7. #26
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer jay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
    I don't think FIP and xFIP are good markers for Deduno. He has continually shown the ability to induce weak contact and is therefore punished by those statistics.
    Precisely. The statistical inputs are HRs (flyballs in xFIP), walks, and strikeouts. Deduno's strengths of a groundball rate approaching 60% (see: 3 inning ending DPs last night) and weak contact isn't captured very well in FIP.

  8. #27
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    Sure, if you want to extend the definition of extension to include "ridiculously low wage, one year deals" I could probably entertain the idea. But I don't find that remotely plausible and anything other than that is a horrible idea.
    No arguments here.

  9. #28
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by drivlikejehu View Post
    I agree he's an adequate back-end starter. That's only a commodity in the eyes of shell shocked Twins fans.
    I don't necessarily agree with that. If Deduno continues pitching around a 100 ERA+ clip, he has value. Despite his age, he's still not even arb eligible. Teams won't give up a lot for him but they'll give up something for a 30 year old with a 100 ERA+ making $1m a season and under team control.

  10. #29
    A couple things for those arguing against trying to win a few more games this year.
    1) The Twins have had three very bad seasons. This season progress needs to be shown. The end of the rebuild needs to be within reach. This team will eventually need to play a competitive .500 season before realistically being thought of as a playoff team.
    2) It will be easier to entice a quality free agent to sign with the Twins in the off season if they seem to be within reach of being a playoff contender. Signing with a .500 team and being 'the missing piece' is easier to swallow than signing with a rebuilding team still waiting for the young guys to advance.
    3) The AL Central seems to be filled with .500 teams this year. With a few breaks, this Twins team could finish second. The Twins seem to be playing competitively with most of the teams they have faced this year. They even won a series vs the Yankees. The have struggled with the couple elite teams, but that should be expected.
    4) Attendance and revenue will suffer both this year and next if the Twins repeat another 90 loss season.

  11. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by drivlikejehu View Post
    That would make no sense for the future of the club.
    Let's take a step back and remember which club we are talking about. In a season where success is 78 wins, the following things are happening:

    -A top prospect, CF is sitting on the bench while another potential future starting SS is playing in CF instead of getting reps at SS (where he needs work defensively)

    -A future catching prospect is playing about twice a week

    -Kevin C. is blocking Meyer and May

    -We have a 34 year old, washed up OF with a .622 OPS getting reps daily

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  13. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
    I don't necessarily agree with that. If Deduno continues pitching around a 100 ERA+ clip, he has value. Despite his age, he's still not even arb eligible. Teams won't give up a lot for him but they'll give up something for a 30 year old with a 100 ERA+ making $1m a season and under team control.
    The Twins got something for Drew Butera. I just mean that Deduno's potential trade value is not something that should really affect how the Twins use him. He's OK and all, but not overly relevant in the scheme of things. I'd just keep him around as a swing guy for the time being, it would be nice to have a spot starter available on staff (especially carrying 12 pitchers).

  14. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Linus View Post
    Now we have a rotation of Hughes, Nolasco, Meyer, May and Gibson which looks promising for the long run.
    I agree, but I think Meyer's rumored innings limit is going to put a big damper on him contributing much in the rotation this season. I can see him being called up to let it fly a few innings in the bullpen each week. The team will need Deduno in the rotation. Hopefully, Swarzak can get back on track as a swingman.

  15. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB_Iowa View Post
    You are right. There's a $9 million club option with a $.5 million buyout.

    Pretty general consensus is that the option won't be exercised.
    So Span sounds like next year's Kubel/Bartlet/Guerrier. Only he'll still likely get a major league contract.

  16. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Badsmerf View Post
    We should package him with some guys to get a young ace pitcher.
    None of the aforementioned players will get you an ace pitcher. Maybe some low A guy with potential. We had to give up Span with his youth and great contract just to get Meyer from a team loaded with arms.

  17. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by nicksaviking View Post
    So Span sounds like next year's Kubel/Bartlet/Guerrier. Only he'll still likely get a major league contract.
    I would rather bring back Shane Mack to block Buxton and Gaetti to block Sano. Or we could trade Buxton and Sano for a really good set up guy. Lock down the 7th or 8th inning and help push towards 80 wins this year.
    Last edited by tobi0040; 06-04-2014 at 12:03 PM.

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  19. #36
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by twinsguy14 View Post
    None of the aforementioned players will get you an ace pitcher. Maybe some low A guy with potential. We had to give up Span with his youth and great contract just to get Meyer from a team loaded with arms.
    It's a running joke. For five years, people have been bundling Duensing into trade packages for good players. It's more than a little absurd.

  20. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Linus View Post
    As ardent Twins fans, we've all been frustrated with our home nine over the last three years and have, understandably, been looking forward to the future when the team would field a lineup of younger, more promising players.

    Don't look know but its happening. With Plouffe and Dozier establishing themselves as quality MLB players and substantial playing time for Arcia, Pinto, Escobar, Santana, Hicks and Gibson, the Twins core players are now represented by younger, up and coming players.

    I am guessing this process will accelerate as we get closer to the trade deadline as I anticipate (hope) that Corriea, Guerrier and Burton will all be dealt and replaced with younger players. I will also include Willingham in that group unless the Twins can hang around. Then I think we should keep him for the rest of the season (no extensions, please).

    Yes, finally!! Now dump some more cold bodies (i.e. Kubel, Guerrier) and get some more talent up here. The futures so bright...I hope to wear shades!

  21. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by twinsguy14 View Post
    Yes, finally!! Now dump some more cold bodies (i.e. Kubel, Guerrier) and get some more talent up here. The futures so bright...I hope to wear shades!
    How did I miss Guerrier! Add him to the list of ridiculous roster blockage. We have 5-6 young AAA relievers with a sub 3.00 ERA.

  22. #39
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Why does everyone want to get rid of Guerrier? He's striking out a batter almost once per three innings.

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  24. #40
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    This season, for me, has reinforced my belief this is not the GM/Manager for a young, rebuilding, team. I am excited to see the future, but it is about as slow at arriving as GRRM is at producing new books.....
    Lighten up Francis....

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