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Thread: Find me a center fielder

  1. #41
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    Anyone know if Andres Torres ever recovered from his injury? He could be a stop gap in center that would not require the Twins to trade anyone. Just $$

  2. #42
    Twins Moderator MVP Riverbrian's Avatar
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    With the quitting LH hitting cold turkey... I'd like to hold my latest judgement of Hicks for a little while.

    However... If Hicks after batting RH only... Actually improves measurably and immediately... I would also like to reserve the right to re-direct my current concern over Hicks to the Twins organization for not recognizing this earlier.

    For now... I reserve all judgement and wait for fresh data.

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  4. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riverbrian View Post
    With the quitting LH hitting cold turkey... I'd like to hold my latest judgement of Hicks for a little while.

    However... If Hicks after batting RH only... Actually improves measurably and immediately... I would also like to reserve the right to re-direct my current concern over Hicks to the Twins organization for not recognizing this earlier.

    For now... I reserve all judgement and wait for fresh data........
    ...to second-guess with later. (Just kidding).

    Cmon RB. You know it, I know it, this is just simply another aspect to how spectacularly badly this whole thing has been bungled from Day 1 in 2013. That this Hicks decision totally came out of Left...er...Center Field, just this morning- from a guy clearly desperate, and hasn't been actively contemplated and tried out in the minors on the part of the Twins before this, is solely on the Twins organization.

  5. #44
    Twins Moderator MVP Riverbrian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jokin View Post
    ...to second-guess with later. (Just kidding).

    Cmon RB. You know it, I know it, this is just simply another aspect to how spectacularly badly this whole thing has been bungled from Day 1 in 2013. That this Hicks decision totally came out of Left...er...Center Field, just this morning- from a guy clearly desperate, and hasn't been actively contemplated and tried out in the minors on the part of the Twins before this, is solely on the Twins organization.
    I have the same suspicion... But I will wait for the fresh data.

  6. #45
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    As mentioned by Leviathon earlier, the Cardinals have a surplus in the OF.

    What would you give up for Jay or Bourjos?

    It would be great if they wanted Burton or Florimon, but the Cardinals won't be dumping them. Would you trade May?

    Walker?

    Fien?

  7. #46
    Senior Member All-Star Thrylos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jorgenswest View Post
    As mentioned by Leviathon earlier, the Cardinals have a surplus in the OF.

    What would you give up for Jay or Bourjos?

    It would be great if they wanted Burton or Florimon, but the Cardinals won't be dumping them. Would you trade May?

    Walker?

    Fien?
    Bourjos and Jay do not belong in the same sentence.

    Bourjos is a 27 y.o RHB who is hitting .204/.274/.310 this season with a career .247/.303/.389 line and 2 arb seasons to come. Candidate to not be offered arbitration after this season. Thanks, I'd pass. Hicks is better.

    Jay is a 29 year old LHB who is hitting .293/.346/.397 this season (almost identical to his .293/.355/.400 - OPS+ 108 career numbers) Also 2 years of arbitration to go. He can also steal a base. For comparison's reference, when traded, then 28 year old Denard Span's career numbers with the Twins were .284/.357/.389 (104 OPS+) Very similar players, but Span's contract situation was better and he was a year older.

    It took Meyer two seasons ago to get Span. Something comparable as far as prospects go, would be Berrios now. Pretty sure that Walker or Fien will not make it happen. There is no way that Burton or Florimon make it happen, but May may. I'd trade Berrios before May, but I'd rather see what Hicks can do for the rest of the season as a RHB.
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  8. #47
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    I would pass on giving up top 10 prospects. Particularly pitching prospects.

    If the Twins care about outfield defense, they would at least have to wonder if Jay is really better on a corner. The Cardinals made the move for Bourjos because of his defense. Has Jay been on the DL? If not, why does he have fewer starts than Bourjos? That includes starts on the corners. Bourjos may not be in the same sentence, but he has been in the starting lineup more often.

  9. #48
    Jon Jay is the answer if we want to fix CF situation. A lefty bat who could hit lead off I would give them Logan Darnell and Dalton Hicks or just Travis Harrison

  10. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustcallupSANO View Post
    Jon Jay is the answer if we want to fix CF situation. A lefty bat who could hit lead off I would give them Logan Darnell and Dalton Hicks or just Travis Harrison
    I would have to think the Cards could get much better than that for Jay.

  11. #50
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    I found a link to this on mlbtraderumors.com https://twitter.com/DarrenWolfson/st...32188794830848

    It basically says the Twins are interested in Jon Jay.

    So what would the Twins have to give up to get Jon Jay? would Rosario and Salcedo get it done?

  12. #51
    Senior Member Triple-A Danchat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brandon View Post
    I found a link to this on mlbtraderumors.com https://twitter.com/DarrenWolfson/st...32188794830848

    It basically says the Twins are interested in Jon Jay.

    So what would the Twins have to give up to get Jon Jay? would Rosario and Salcedo get it done?
    Eh, I don't know if Jay is worth Rosario. I don't think I'd do that trade.

  13. #52
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    Basically what Thrylos said: a Meyer type prospect at minimum. Might not seem fair but the Twins would be bargaining from a position of need, against other teams who also are seeking outfield help.

  14. #53
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    The Cardinals aren't getting a top 50 prospect for Jay.

  15. #54
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    The Twins need hitting not fielding. It would be ridiculously foolish to trade someone who is deemed "part of the future" to satisfy a temporary need in CF--for a losing team. Another "replacement level" CF only clouds the issue.

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  17. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kwak View Post
    The Twins need hitting not fielding. It would be ridiculously foolish to trade someone who is deemed "part of the future" to satisfy a temporary need in CF--for a losing team. Another "replacement level" CF only clouds the issue.
    Replacement level? Jay has 9.6 career WAR in 5 seasons in limited action in some. Had a 3.4 and 2.9 WAR season. That is not replacement level
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  18. #56
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    Offensively, Jay and Span are a match. I am not so sure they are a match with the glove.

    We could look at defensive metrics to answer the question and then argue their value. I don't think we need to do that. The Cardinals have answered the question by trading for Bourjos and playing him in spite of a dismal April performance. Jay's bat is clearly better. Good enough to be ranked 13th among CFs last year by RC+. Why replace him? Why look for a replacement? He's 29. He has a reasonable contract.

    It has to be the glove. They must not feel it is adequate for CF. Last year was his first as a regular at that position. Enough time for the Cardinals to assess that they should look elsewhere.

    He helps the Twins this year more than the Cardinals. However, I don't think he is a building block for the future. I would keep my building blocks. I wouldn't trade good up the middle or starting pitching prospects. They are too hard to acquire. I might sell high on Vargas though.

  19. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by jorgenswest View Post
    Offensively, Jay and Span are a match.



    He helps the Twins this year more than the Cardinals. However, I don't think he is a building block for the future. I would keep my building blocks. I wouldn't trade good up the middle or starting pitching prospects. They are too hard to acquire. I might sell high on Vargas though.
    And the Twins are expected to trade? for an extra 2-3 wins? So the Twins can win maybe 75--and still be irrelevant? No. As posted he's 29, and would just be in the way after this year. Take the lumps (and the losses) by playing who is on the roster and draft one or two slots higher in June 2015.

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  21. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kwak View Post
    And the Twins are expected to trade? for an extra 2-3 wins? So the Twins can win maybe 75--and still be irrelevant? No. As posted he's 29, and would just be in the way after this year. Take the lumps (and the losses) by playing who is on the roster and draft one or two slots higher in June 2015.
    It depends on what we have to give up to acquire him. With a .750 OPS He hits just enough to be a corner OF when Buxton comes up plus his defense will grade out better there too. I don't know what St Louis would want in a trade for him but we could offer a bunch of different prospect combinations. They might be interested in pitchers in the lower minors since they have strong depth at the majors already. They may want middle IF,
    What about Deunsing as part of the package. I see they can use some bullpen help. beyond that I guess they would want to improve their minors with more prospects.

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  23. #59
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    what is wrong with playing Danny Santana in CF? He's fast. He's hitting. He can learn to play center field faster than Hicks can learn to hit RH pitchers from the right side of the plate.

    This is a fun situation. I like Escobar at short and defense was always Santana's weakness as a shortstop.

    Unless we risk trying Dozier again at SS, we don't need more 2nd basemen. So lets enjoy watching Santana's progress.

  24. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thegrin View Post
    what is wrong with playing Danny Santana in CF? He's fast. He's hitting. He can learn to play center field faster than Hicks can learn to hit RH pitchers from the right side of the plate.

    This is a fun situation. I like Escobar at short and defense was always Santana's weakness as a shortstop.

    Unless we risk trying Dozier again at SS, we don't need more 2nd basemen. So lets enjoy watching Santana's progress.
    You are on to something here...

    I've been stuck on the notion that Santana is the short stop of the future, but like you say, he's struggled with SS in the past. I have been arguing for Escobar to take over at SS (as a better alternative to P-Flo) bridge to Santana, when a Santana is ready.

    Well I got what I wanted and Escobar has been better than expected. Over the last month he's been a very good fielder and hit well. I don't think he can maintain hitting the was he has, but there is only one way to find out for certain.

    Does Escobar at SS and a Santana in CF solve the issues? Maybe...

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