Minnesota Twins News & Rumors Forum
Page 8 of 18 FirstFirst ... 678910 ... LastLast
Results 141 to 160 of 350

Thread: Article: Why is Joe Mauer Such a Lightning Rod?

  1. #141
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
    Posts
    2,272
    Like
    241
    Liked 464 Times in 291 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Brooks View Post
    Is Shin Soo Choo a top 5 player in baseball?

    I'm sorry, Mauer is a great player, but I'm afraid I can't get on the bandwagon that you just sort by OBP and there is your list of best players in baseball. So much more to the game than JUST getting on base, especially when some of the sluggers also have an OBP that is at least in the neighborhood of Mauer's.
    Shin Soo Choo might be one of the better players right now, but I would take Mauer's production since 2005 over Choo's, no? Part of Mauer's greatness is consistency over the last decade. When I say he's a top five player, that's what I mean. Few can claim his cumulative offensive contributions over that span. None have done it from the most valuable defensive position on the field.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  2. This user likes cmathewson's post and wants to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    LaBombo (04-10-2014)

  3. #142
    Senior Member Double-A
    Posts
    127
    Like
    0
    Liked 35 Times in 20 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1
    Math aside, I would like to hear of the signature moments from Mauer's career. What did he do in a game that shows everyone what Mauer is about? Boil all the statistics down, the OBP, the WARs, the Gold Gloves, throw them all into a cauldron and somebody tell me of one thing, one moment, one game, one at bat, that is a signature Mauer moment.

    For me, there are two: Mauer fields a line-drive deflection off some flunky Twins pitcher, he was playing catcher, and ran up the first base line, gets the ball and then races back and dives to tag out Brett Gardner at the plate in Yankee Stadium. Not often you get that level of exertion out of Joe, but a singular play, athletic, heady and strong.

    The other moment was also at Yankee Stadium, in the playoffs in, what was it, 2009? Phil Cuzzi just blows a call on a ball Mauer hits down the left-field line. Not only did the ball land fair, it was deflected toward the line by Melky Cabrera (?). And the money shot is Mauer checking up at 2B and looking somewhat indifferent as he heads back to the plate. Of course, the Twins lose again in New York and end up getting swept.

    Mauer or no Mauer, a leadership guy has to provide something. It ain't going to be on defense anymore, so Mauer needs to do something more than pepper the LF of opposing teams with a series of bloops, flies and liners.

  4. These 2 users like Old Twins Cap's post and want to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    mike wants wins (04-10-2014), Ultima Ratio (04-10-2014)

  5. #143
    Senior Member All-Star Sconnie's Avatar
    Posts
    1,101
    Like
    617
    Liked 397 Times in 262 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    Why is Joe Mauer a lightning rod? Because he's the rod and not the lightning. Sure the rod is darn important, but it's not explosive. He's not a catcher anymore, he's a highly paid veteran leader first basemen, and highly paid veteran leader first basemen are supposed to be the lightning. They're supposed to be the vocal leader who bats cleanup, and hits a lot of home runs. The only problem is Justin Morneau circa 2009 is in the past. Who is going to be the lightning?

  6. #144
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
    Posts
    2,272
    Like
    241
    Liked 464 Times in 291 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by D. Hocking View Post
    Randball had a column a year or two ago that was basically Mauer -- most controversial non-controversial figure, or most interesting boring guy (or something like that). This thread reflects that a bit. He does generate a bit of discussion. Still, even though things got a little heated at times, I suspect things could have gotten really ugly on this topic on other forums.

    Kudos for no complete meltdown by anyone.
    I'm surprised that so many fall on the anti-Mauer side, considering how he is regarded outside of Minnesota. I expected as much from a collection of Strib comentators, but not from people who know enough about baseball to admit that avoiding outs is the most important aspect of an offensive players' contributions.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  7. This user likes cmathewson's post and wants to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    LaBombo (04-10-2014)

  8. #145
    Senior Member All-Star LaBombo's Avatar
    Posts
    2,821
    Like
    1,648
    Liked 1,681 Times in 840 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Twins Cap View Post
    Math aside, I would like to hear of the signature moments from Mauer's career. What did he do in a game that shows everyone what Mauer is about? Boil all the statistics down, the OBP, the WARs, the Gold Gloves, throw them all into a cauldron and somebody tell me of one thing, one moment, one game, one at bat, that is a signature Mauer moment.

    Has there ever been a more succinct, precise, compact and yet comprehensive summary of how the Twins have utterly and lately abysmally failed to capitalize on having one of the best players in the history of the game for a decade?

  9. These 3 users like LaBombo's post and want to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    Dman (04-10-2014), jokin (04-09-2014), twinsnorth49 (04-10-2014)

  10. #146
    Senior Member Triple-A
    Posts
    245
    Like
    0
    Liked 51 Times in 26 Posts
    I got censured for calling someone a moron that basically said that Mauer was an overrated, average ballplayer. Since I am not aiming this sentiment at a specific person I assume it will be allowed this time

  11. #147
    Senior Member All-Star Sconnie's Avatar
    Posts
    1,101
    Like
    617
    Liked 397 Times in 262 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Twins Cap View Post
    Math aside, I would like to hear of the signature moments from Mauer's career. What did he do in a game that shows everyone what Mauer is about? Boil all the statistics down, the OBP, the WARs, the Gold Gloves, throw them all into a cauldron and somebody tell me of one thing, one moment, one game, one at bat, that is a signature Mauer moment.

    For me, there are two: Mauer fields a line-drive deflection off some flunky Twins pitcher, he was playing catcher, and ran up the first base line, gets the ball and then races back and dives to tag out Brett Gardner at the plate in Yankee Stadium. Not often you get that level of exertion out of Joe, but a singular play, athletic, heady and strong.

    The other moment was also at Yankee Stadium, in the playoffs in, what was it, 2009? Phil Cuzzi just blows a call on a ball Mauer hits down the left-field line. Not only did the ball land fair, it was deflected toward the line by Melky Cabrera (?). And the money shot is Mauer checking up at 2B and looking somewhat indifferent as he heads back to the plate. Of course, the Twins lose again in New York and end up getting swept.

    Mauer or no Mauer, a leadership guy has to provide something. It ain't going to be on defense anymore, so Mauer needs to do something more than pepper the LF of opposing teams with a series of bloops, flies and liners.
    I think the signature characteristic of Joe Mauer is (when healthy) he is the most consistently very good hitter to have played the game. Doing so from the catcher position doesn't matter anymore as it is only contextual to the past.

  12. This user likes Sconnie's post and wants to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    LaBombo (04-09-2014)

  13. #148
    Senior Member Triple-A D. Hocking's Avatar
    Posts
    273
    Like
    54
    Liked 380 Times in 144 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Twins Cap View Post
    And the money shot is Mauer checking up at 2B and looking somewhat indifferent as he heads back to the plate.
    I know he gets criticized for being unemotional, but I would think this is one time where it was important for him to remain calm and cool and not let his emotions get to him, since he had to immediately go to bat again - where he did get another hit.

  14. These 2 users like D. Hocking's post and want to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    Dman (04-10-2014), LaBombo (04-09-2014)

  15. #149
    Twins News Team MVP
    Posts
    6,752
    Like
    875
    Liked 854 Times in 550 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
    Shin Soo Choo might be one of the better players right now, but I would take Mauer's production since 2005 over Choo's, no? Part of Mauer's greatness is consistency over the last decade. When I say he's a top five player, that's what I mean. Few can claim his cumulative offensive contributions over that span.

    None have done it from the most valuable defensive position on the field.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sconnie View Post
    I think the signature characteristic of Joe Mauer is (when healthy) he is the most consistently very good hitter to have played the game. Doing so from the catcher position doesn't matter anymore as it is only contextual to the past.

    Although not the definitive jab at Mauer, many use the argument about his lack of durability, and the disturbing trend to even less and less of that trait and less and less value derived from a part-time catcher- to being positionally misplaced to derive full value as a full-time 1st Baseman.

    Since 2004- 54.5% of all possible games started at Catcher.
    Since 2005- 58.7% of all possible games started at Catcher.
    Since 2007- 52.1% of all possible games started at Catcher.
    Since 2009- 49.4% of all possible games started at Catcher.

    (FWIW, I advocated the "Carlos Santana plan" in the wake of his first injury in 2004- we might be talking about a guy already well-past 2000 hits and much healthier as he heads into his 30s).
    Last edited by jokin; 04-09-2014 at 11:43 PM.

  16. This user likes jokin's post and wants to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    LaBombo (04-09-2014)

  17. #150
    Senior Member All-Star Sconnie's Avatar
    Posts
    1,101
    Like
    617
    Liked 397 Times in 262 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
    I'm surprised that so many fall on the anti-Mauer side, considering how he is regarded outside of Minnesota. I expected as much from a collection of Strib comentators, but not from people who know enough about baseball to admit that avoiding outs is the most important aspect of an offensive players' contributions.
    As the Vikings fans here know, the most popular guy on a losing football team is the backup quarterback. Joe's the quarterback of this team. It doesn't matter how many outs he's avoided if the team loses 90 games, he's still the quarterback of a 90 fame losing team.

    Truthfully I'm a fan of what Mauer did as a catcher. He was one of the greatest catchers we may ever see play this game. I'm reserving judgement as a first basemen.

    I understand where a lot of the issue is with Joe. He isn't the player, that so many fans want him to be.

  18. These 3 users like Sconnie's post and want to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    JB_Iowa (04-10-2014), LaBombo (04-09-2014), mike wants wins (04-10-2014)

  19. #151
    Twins News Team MVP
    Posts
    6,752
    Like
    875
    Liked 854 Times in 550 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    Quote Originally Posted by LaBombo View Post
    Has there ever been a more succinct, precise, compact and yet comprehensive summary of how the Twins have utterly and lately abysmally failed to capitalize on having one of the best players in the history of the game for a decade?
    Forget the multiple failures to even once go all-in during Mauer's prime years when the team had some of the best players in the game around him......I'm still waiting for them to implement their contingency Plan B, when the bulk of "Plan A"- less the securing the the "Face of the Franchise" for 8 years and a new outdoor stadium- crashed and burned almost the second it was put in place in 2011.

  20. These 2 users like jokin's post and want to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    LaBombo (04-09-2014), mike wants wins (04-10-2014)

  21. #152
    Twins Moderator All-Star twinsnorth49's Avatar
    Posts
    3,646
    Like
    932
    Liked 1,285 Times in 688 Posts
    Where does this belief that to be a leader you have to be some loud mouth idiot come from? Honestly it's so cliche and myopic.

    Mauer appears to be a leader to me, he leads by example with his preparation, consistency and ability to do what's necessary to help his team. He's not a demonstrative goofball, so this means he's not a leader? I just don't get it.

  22. These 2 users like twinsnorth49's post and want to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    Dman (04-10-2014), LaBombo (04-10-2014)

  23. #153
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
    Posts
    8,120
    Twitter
    @rocketpig76
    Like
    49
    Liked 1,593 Times in 828 Posts
    Blog Entries
    6
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Twins Cap
    The other moment was also at Yankee Stadium, in the playoffs in, what was it, 2009? Phil Cuzzi just blows a call on a ball Mauer hits down the left-field line. Not only did the ball land fair, it was deflected toward the line by Melky Cabrera (?). And the money shot is Mauer checking up at 2B and looking somewhat indifferent as he heads back to the plate. Of course, the Twins lose again in New York and end up getting swept.
    It is flat-out embarrassing for any rational human to twist that PA into a detriment.

    The guy had a double stolen and STILL turned it into a walk.

    What, and you're complaining that he walked it off?

    Brain hurts.

  24. #154
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
    Posts
    8,120
    Twitter
    @rocketpig76
    Like
    49
    Liked 1,593 Times in 828 Posts
    Blog Entries
    6
    Quote Originally Posted by twinsnorth49 View Post
    Where does this belief that to be a leader you have to be some loud mouth idiot come from? Honestly it's so cliche and myopic.

    Mauer appears to be a leader to me, he leads by example with his preparation, consistency and ability to do what's necessary to help his team. He's not a demonstrative goofball, so this means he's not a leader? I just don't get it.
    All you have to do is read one little line from Parker's excellent Colabello article to know all you need to know about Joe Mauer's "leadership".

  25. #155
    Twins Moderator MVP USAFChief's Avatar
    Posts
    6,607
    Like
    3,679
    Liked 3,167 Times in 1,356 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
    I'm surprised that so many fall on the anti-Mauer side, considering how he is regarded outside of Minnesota. I expected as much from a collection of Strib comentators, but not from people who know enough about baseball to admit that avoiding outs is the most important aspect of an offensive players' contributions.
    I think there's a difference between being "anti-Mauer" and admitting he's not an elite hitter.

    Mauer is good at avoiding outs and hitting for average. He's a good bet to be among the ten best in in MLB OBP every year. He's in the top 50 all time in MLB history.

    But some of us don't think that alone makes you a great hitter.
    Every post is not every other post. - a wise man

  26. This user likes USAFChief's post and wants to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    mike wants wins (04-10-2014)

  27. #156
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
    Posts
    8,120
    Twitter
    @rocketpig76
    Like
    49
    Liked 1,593 Times in 828 Posts
    Blog Entries
    6
    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    Mauer is good at avoiding outs and hitting for average. He's a good bet to be among the ten best in in MLB OBP every year. He's inthe top 50 all time in MLB history.

    But some of us don't think that alone makes you a great hitter.
    Was Rod Carew a great hitter?

    I really don't understand why we don't accept that not making an out is the key to offense.

    Yeah, some hitters don't make outs AND hit homers. They're rare.

  28. This user likes Brock Beauchamp's post and wants to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    cmathewson (04-10-2014)

  29. #157
    Twins Moderator All-Star twinsnorth49's Avatar
    Posts
    3,646
    Like
    932
    Liked 1,285 Times in 688 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
    All you have to do is read one little line from Parker's excellent Colabello article to know all you need to know about Joe Mauer's "leadership".

    I did and mentioned it in another thread, it speaks volumes to me, especially coming from a guy who's in a position to know.

  30. #158
    Senior Member All-Star LaBombo's Avatar
    Posts
    2,821
    Like
    1,648
    Liked 1,681 Times in 840 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    I think there's a difference between being "anti-Mauer" and admitting he's not an elite hitter.
    He was indesbutably an elite hitter as a catcher. He's not at first until the prognostications about big silver lining jumps in offensive quantity and quality about the switch come true for the next half decade.

  31. #159
    Twins Moderator All-Star twinsnorth49's Avatar
    Posts
    3,646
    Like
    932
    Liked 1,285 Times in 688 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Brooks View Post
    I'm not even sure what this means, or how it relates.
    I guess if you're being obtuse, I think you're deliberately distorting the opinion of the poster you quoted.
    It's really just about how silly it is to second guess a single at bat by a guy who hits at the rate Mauer does. It's pretty easy to see a good pitch go by from your couch, I'll trust whatever Joe was thinking and feeling at the time, he's earned that.

    I don't think Mauer is above criticism but this is a stretch. Seriously? He doesn't get the pitch he was looking for, works a walk to keep the inning alive and this earns him scorn?


  32. #160
    Senior Member Triple-A h2oface's Avatar
    Posts
    372
    Like
    72
    Liked 42 Times in 30 Posts
    Blog Entries
    4
    Quote Originally Posted by Bark's Lounge View Post
    He < Joe Mauer > has not done anything to draw Hollywood attention.............
    Well played Mauer........ er, i mean......... Bark's Lounge.

Page 8 of 18 FirstFirst ... 678910 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
©2014 TwinsCentric, LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Interested in advertising with Twins Daily? Click here.