Minnesota Twins News & Rumors Forum
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 21 to 40 of 40

Thread: Article: Twins Final Cuts: Much Ado About (Almost) Nothing

  1. #21
    I had been strongly against bringing Kubel and Bartlett north, for the usual reasons - lack of spring performance, limited chance of participating in future team improvement, etc. - but am now coming around to the decision.

    Whether you think this team will win 65 or 75 games (does anyone expect more?), two months of Kubel and Bartlett, even if they are terrible, will not make meaningfully change the result negatively from what Parmalee or Presley would have produced. If they are terrible, and the team otherwise is performing well, they will be replaced.

    If they are adequate, however, but the team is on path for another 65-70 win season, the explanation that was given about their value in the clubhouse makes sense. As veterans who have won and lost, they will likely roll more with the ups and downs of the team's and their personal performance. In that situation, they are more likely than Parmalee, Presley or others to remind the rest of the clubhouse that they are playing a fun game that has lots of ups and downs, not to get stuck in the downs, and to keep focusing on doing your best everyday. K and B may not worry as much about how many at-bats they get each week and whether they performed well enough to keep their jobs. If K and B have this attitude, they will benefit the other younger players on the team. Presley and others, perhaps, could handle the situation differently, by focusing on what it means to him and his future, which would not benefit other players who are bigger parts of the team's future.
    "Where's the Crede?"

  2. #22
    Senior Member Double-A
    Posts
    100
    Like
    18
    Liked 39 Times in 26 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    My deal is mostly that we had a horrible offense last year and all we came up with to help out was Kubel and Bartlett(as you mention towards the end of your article). Granted, if we are healthier this year and a few guys improve we could get a little more production out of what we have. I just want to feel like management is scratching and clawing to get us out of the cellar. It was great that we got some pitching help. But, it would be a feel good gesture for me if they could add a dandy stick to this squad who can really mash.

  3. #23
    Yes, you can argue about Deduno and Colabello, who both had great spring trainings. They outplayed Diamond and Parmelee, who are still with the organization as fodder. So, no real loss.

    Kubel and Bartlett do bring experience. But Willingham had a horrible spring, and I'm worried about Arcia (and the Twins total strikeouts, again, this season).

    The Twins have strength in the bullpen. Tonkin, Guerra (the last of the Santana puzzle can still produce), Hoffman, Oliveros, Thompson plus any and all prosspects.

    Do we know how many of these guys will be around next year (predict).

    If Pinto produces, then we have Herrmann and Rohlfing in the wings as able backups, and you can always find another vet to stash at Triple-A (on that note, Rene Rivera and Drew Butera both broke spring training this year).

    It will be a long season.

  4. #24
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
    Posts
    4,866
    Like
    182
    Liked 668 Times in 377 Posts
    I think all this "It's only the 25th roster spot!" stuff misses the forest for the trees. If your 1-9 is going to be a combination of bad, easily hurt, or coming off a poor season....you'd hope your bench would at least offer you some alternatives that are at least intriguing.

    This is a lineup with huge questions, a bench with little to offer, and AAA stacked with guys like Wilkin Ramirez as the next best options. The frustration has more to do with how poorly the offensive side of the roster was constructed than about who slots in at what spot.

  5. #25
    I'm obviously in the minority here, but I'm on board with the moves.

    Kubel is a bit questionable, but I think it is likely the FO essentially guaranteed him a roster spot when he signed a minor league deal, and if so, I don't blame Terry & Co for keeping that probable promise.

    As for Bartlett, granted he had a terrible spring and hasn't played much the last 2 years, but he's won in MN in the past plus has experience winning for one of the best managers in baseball down in Tampa. This wave of youth needs a presence in the clubhouse, and the perceived quiet lead-by-example ways of Mauer/Willingham is one thing, but a guy with a little more edge and a voice is also important. 25th spot on the roster at the expense of Parmelee is worth it in my opinion.

    Financial commitment is minimal on both and if it doesn't work out they can be jettisoned relatively painlessly.

  6. #26
    Senior Member All-Star Jim Crikket's Avatar
    Posts
    1,094
    Like
    15
    Liked 122 Times in 61 Posts
    Blog Entries
    77
    Quote Originally Posted by Hosken Bombo Disco View Post
    Cricket, what I read from the article is that much ado was given on the final spring training cuts based on universally poor spring training performances. You didn't mention Chris Herrmann - how would you measure his youth, position flexibility, and actually pretty good spring training performance against the decision to go with guys like Kubel, Colabello, or Bartlett. I ask because I was pulling for Herrmann.
    Sorry, I was going to respond to your first question about Herrmann, but then I got distracted.

    I like Herrmann, but I haven't seen enough of him to feel strongly about his long term potential to be meaningful contributor. I thought he had a chance to stick, given Gardy's aversion to using his backup catcher as a DH and Pinto should get more plate appearances than he's likely to get just from games he catches. Herrmann could have provided more flexibility than Kubel for one of those last roster spots certainly.

    On the other hand, IF the Twins think Herrmann has potential just beyond a backup role player, then he needs to be getting regular playing time and he wasn't going to get that in Minnesota tostart the season.

    If he performs well in Rochester, I would fully expect Herrmann to get his opportunity with the Twins at some point this summer.
    I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at Knuckleballsblog.com while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for MetroSportsReport.com.

    ~You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant~

  7. This user likes Jim Crikket's post and wants to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    Hosken Bombo Disco (03-30-2014)

  8. #27
    Senior Member All-Star Jim Crikket's Avatar
    Posts
    1,094
    Like
    15
    Liked 122 Times in 61 Posts
    Blog Entries
    77
    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    I think all this "It's only the 25th roster spot!" stuff misses the forest for the trees. If your 1-9 is going to be a combination of bad, easily hurt, or coming off a poor season....you'd hope your bench would at least offer you some alternatives that are at least intriguing.
    If there were truly intriguing alternatives within the organization, I'd hope that they'd be in that bad 1-9 order somewhere, not on the bench.
    I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at Knuckleballsblog.com while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for MetroSportsReport.com.

    ~You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant~

  9. #28
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
    Posts
    4,866
    Like
    182
    Liked 668 Times in 377 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Crikket View Post
    If there were truly intriguing alternatives within the organization, I'd hope that they'd be in that bad 1-9 order somewhere, not on the bench.
    That's just it, Bartlett embodies precisely that problem.

  10. #29
    Twins Moderator MVP USAFChief's Avatar
    Posts
    6,608
    Like
    3,682
    Liked 3,170 Times in 1,357 Posts
    I'm in a small minority in this opinion, but my thought is that Bartlett is around more as a cheap possible alternative to Florimon than anything else.

    If he's truly around as a "chemistry whisperer" that makes it a lot worse, IMO, and confirms, for me at least, my opionion from last year that Gardenhire shouldn't be around as manager any more. I do concur the team last year had the stink of losing hanging heavily over it, but that should primarily be on the manager to fix, not the 25th guy on the roster, who quite possibly won't be here past June 1st unless things go really bad for others or unexpectedly good for him.
    Every post is not every other post. - a wise man

  11. #30
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
    Posts
    2,272
    Like
    241
    Liked 464 Times in 291 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    That's just it, Bartlett embodies precisely that problem.
    Those options went poof this spring with the Sano injury, the baffling absence of Rosario and Buxton's wrist.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  12. #31
    Twins Moderator MVP USAFChief's Avatar
    Posts
    6,608
    Like
    3,682
    Liked 3,170 Times in 1,357 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
    Those options went poof this spring with the Sano injury, the baffling absence of Rosario and Buxton's wrist.
    I doubt any of those, except possibly Sano, were ever realistic options this spring. And We'll never know, but I think Sano was unlikely to go north even if he was healthy and played like an AS all through spring training.
    Every post is not every other post. - a wise man

  13. #32
    Twins News Team MVP
    Posts
    6,763
    Like
    884
    Liked 860 Times in 554 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Crikket View Post
    If there were truly intriguing alternatives within the organization, I'd hope that they'd be in that bad 1-9 order somewhere, not on the bench.
    Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
    Those options went poof this spring with the Sano injury, the baffling absence of Rosario and Buxton's wrist.

    And why should the alternatives have been limited to just prospects within the organization and Ex-Twins coming back on sweetheart deals?

  14. This user likes jokin's post and wants to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    JB_Iowa (03-30-2014)

  15. #33
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
    Posts
    4,866
    Like
    182
    Liked 668 Times in 377 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
    Those options went poof this spring with the Sano injury, the baffling absence of Rosario and Buxton's wrist.
    Only one of those three was realistically on this roster right now.

    The problem was targeting Presley in a trade and then giving him away for nothing. That and spending the offseason acquiring guys that are husks of good players.

  16. #34
    Senior Member All-Star
    Posts
    1,494
    Like
    156
    Liked 144 Times in 75 Posts
    Actually, I'd day keeping the jasons over hermann is a pretty big something.
    Not because of anything that any of those 3 would or would not do, but because keeping hermann would allow Pinto to play everyday. With a third catcher, Pinto could dh on the days he is not catching.
    And don't tell me he will without a third catcher. Gardy has a pretty defined track record regarding this, and zebras don't change their stripes.

  17. #35
    Senior Member All-Star
    Posts
    3,614
    Like
    69
    Liked 382 Times in 234 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by AWOLNATION_11 View Post
    Financial commitment is minimal on both and if it doesn't work out they can be jettisoned relatively painlessly.
    The financial commitment would have been even less had they started in Rochester.

  18. #36
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
    Posts
    3,994
    Like
    4
    Liked 124 Times in 90 Posts
    Blog Entries
    67
    Quote Originally Posted by JB_Iowa View Post
    Factually, it is much ado about (almost) nothing.

    Symbolically, it is representative of the uninspired course that this organization has been following for (more) than the past three years.

    How many teams seek to change "team chemistry" through the 25th man on their roster? Teams change team chemistry by changing the leadership of the organization -- the GM and/or the manager. And then they may make some additions or deletions to the roster that contribute to a change in chemistry.

    Will Bartlett (or Kubel) for that matter make or break this team? No. But it just demonstrates that the "old boys club" atmosphere is still in place in Minnesota. Same old, same old.
    Boom. Exactly.

  19. #37
    Senior Member All-Star Jim Crikket's Avatar
    Posts
    1,094
    Like
    15
    Liked 122 Times in 61 Posts
    Blog Entries
    77
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Brooks View Post
    Actually, I'd day keeping the jasons over hermann is a pretty big something.
    Not because of anything that any of those 3 would or would not do, but because keeping hermann would allow Pinto to play everyday. With a third catcher, Pinto could dh on the days he is not catching.
    And don't tell me he will without a third catcher. Gardy has a pretty defined track record regarding this, and zebras don't change their stripes.
    I don't think there's any way Pinto was going to break camp as anything resembling a primary DH. The aspect of his game that needs to develop is defense and he should be attached to Suzuki at the hip for the first several weeks, learning how a MLB catcher prepares to call a game and works with the pitchers.
    I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at Knuckleballsblog.com while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for MetroSportsReport.com.

    ~You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant~

  20. #38
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
    Posts
    3,994
    Like
    4
    Liked 124 Times in 90 Posts
    Blog Entries
    67
    Florimon is going to play out of the gates, right? So now there is no excuse to have Bartlett instead of Herrmann on this roster. A couple of things will make this clear:

    1. If Jason Kubel is DHing EVER against LH pitching (instead of Pinto)
    2. If Bartlett starts looking bad in the OF and the Twins have to keep both Willingham and Arcia in the corners late in games.

  21. #39
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
    Posts
    2,272
    Like
    241
    Liked 464 Times in 291 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by Shane Wahl View Post
    Florimon is going to play out of the gates, right? So now there is no excuse to have Bartlett instead of Herrmann on this roster. A couple of things will make this clear:

    1. If Jason Kubel is DHing EVER against LH pitching (instead of Pinto)
    2. If Bartlett starts looking bad in the OF and the Twins have to keep both Willingham and Arcia in the corners late in games.
    Well, the reasons they might cite is that Bartlett can pinch run and play center field. I'm not sure how well he can do either relative to Hermann. Somewhat better for sure.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  22. #40
    Senior Member All-Star
    Posts
    1,494
    Like
    156
    Liked 144 Times in 75 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Crikket View Post
    I don't think there's any way Pinto was going to break camp as anything resembling a primary DH. The aspect of his game that needs to develop is defense and he should be attached to Suzuki at the hip for the first several weeks, learning how a MLB catcher prepares to call a game and works with the pitchers.
    I guess I'm not sure how DH'ing on the days he's not catching would affect any of what you just said.

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
©2014 TwinsCentric, LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Interested in advertising with Twins Daily? Click here.