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Thread: Diamond on Waivers

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
    Yeah, just heard on the radio that Gilmartin is going to New Britain instead of Darnell (as well as Dean).
    This makes more sense and confirms what Biggentleben was saying about where Gilmartin was at ability-wise, right after the Doumit trade. He hasn't come close to mastering AAA in 2 tries and was only fair-to-middlin' in AA in 2012. The good news is he's still only 23 and has a little time to straighten things out on what looks to be a pretty good club at New Britain. He better make it happen in the next season and a half though, because the power arms in A and A+ will be right around him by then, and he appears to be walking a fine line with his stuff.

  2. #62
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    Does anybody know if Diamond will continue to start or will he work out of the bullpen?

  3. #63
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer
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    Diamond pitched to day in the minors. Early start because of rain threat, so I missed it and got there as the games were ending.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by pierre75275 View Post
    Does anybody know if Diamond will continue to start or will he work out of the bullpen?
    It's been pretty widely reported that he will be a "likely" starter. I think Antony even mentioned it as well on the air.

    http://www.1500espn.com/sportswire/S...ochester032914

  5. #65
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jokin View Post
    This makes more sense and confirms what Biggentleben was saying about where Gilmartin was at ability-wise, right after the Doumit trade. He hasn't come close to mastering AAA in 2 tries and was only fair-to-middlin' in AA in 2012. The good news is he's still only 23 and has a little time to straighten things out on what looks to be a pretty good club at New Britain. He better make it happen in the next season and a half though, because the power arms in A and A+ will be right around him by then, and he appears to be walking a fine line with his stuff.
    Gilmartin's AA in 2012 was decent: 3.49 FIP with good peripherals. Last year, he was injured. So we'll see. But I do like rewarding Darnell for his good pitching and forcing Gilmartin to earn his way in this organization.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by jokin View Post
    This makes more sense and confirms what Biggentleben was saying about where Gilmartin was at ability-wise, right after the Doumit trade. He hasn't come close to mastering AAA in 2 tries and was only fair-to-middlin' in AA in 2012. The good news is he's still only 23 and has a little time to straighten things out on what looks to be a pretty good club at New Britain. He better make it happen in the next season and a half though, because the power arms in A and A+ will be right around him by then, and he appears to be walking a fine line with his stuff.
    So the Doumit trade was basically a salary dump with a broken chicken wing tossed in?

  7. #67
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kwak View Post
    So the Doumit trade was basically a salary dump with a broken chicken wing tossed in?
    The jury is out. When he was drafted, he looked like a future #4 starter. He hurt his shoulder last year, and pitched with it, which affected his stuff. He's healthy this spring and back to the guy he was in 2012, according to reports. He would be in the AAA rotation but for the Diamond situation. It's more of a matter of space than anything. I'm sure it was really close between him and Darnell.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Kwak View Post
    So the Doumit trade was basically a salary dump with a broken chicken wing tossed in?
    Yes, for the Doumit-Gilmartin trade, seems like it was a salary dump in exchange for a lottery ticket, based on the possibility of Gilmartin's returning to promise if he recovers from injury, with a high end of being better than Diamond (yeah, I know, still not exactly the [certain recent Super Bowl half-time performer] of high ends). Interestingly, this explanation has now been transmuted in some corners to the Revere-Worley/May trade, incorrectly, in my opinion, to explain why Worley's not working out is understandable. Seems to fit for the reduction of Doumit and the gain of Gilmartin, but not for the loss of Revere and the acquisition of Worley, who was supposed to be at least a competent #3-5 starter for a few years.
    "Where's the Crede?"

  9. #69
    Please ban me! All-Star stringer bell's Avatar
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    Well, maybe the Twins are doing something right. There are several players being designated with the rosters needing to be finalized and some of them could help the Twins. They have two spots left on the 40-man and it appears they can make room on the 25-man (Colabello and Bartlett) if they need to do so.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
    The jury is out. When he was drafted, he looked like a future #4 starter. He hurt his shoulder last year, and pitched with it, which affected his stuff. He's healthy this spring and back to the guy he was in 2012, according to reports. He would be in the AAA rotation but for the Diamond situation. It's more of a matter of space than anything. I'm sure it was really close between him and Darnell.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kwak View Post
    So the Doumit trade was basically a salary dump with a broken chicken wing tossed in?
    That was Ben's take, anyway. And since Christy is right that it was probably close between Gilmartin (1st rd pick) and Darnell (6th rd. pick), I take that as not a good sign that he has regained full health and/or effectiveness, for the present season, anyway. The Baseball Cube's analysis illustrates this concern and why the jury should be out given his 2 bad performance stints at AAA:


    Gilmartin's ratings:
    Control
    78
    K-Rating
    55
    Efficiency
    58
    vsPower
    37
    Health
    100

    Darnell's ratings:
    Control
    53
    K-Rating
    36
    Efficiency
    46
    vsPower
    58
    Health
    100
    Regarding Gilmartin's AA year in 2012, yes it wasn't bad, but I still go with "fair to middlin" as I would have expected a First Rd. pick and a top 200-type prospect to have done a little better than that. He still has a slightly better 5-year projection than Darnell (Darnell projects to average around a 5.10 ERA/4.90 FIP over 5 years and never topping 0.4 fWAR vs. Gilmartin with a 4.73 ERA/4.80 FIP), but clearly he needs to return to full health, and then he must still surpass all of those on the list in front of him.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by stringer bell View Post
    Well, maybe the Twins are doing something right. There are several players being designated with the rosters needing to be finalized and some of them could help the Twins. They have two spots left on the 40-man and it appears they can make room on the 25-man (Colabello and Bartlett) if they need to do so.
    Just some of them? and only if they need to do so?

    I get what they're trying to set up, but do they have a firm plan in place to not only pull the trigger, but the willingness to cut Barlett after what they've just gone through in justifying him being on the 25-man? I still say they can keep Bartlett and option Florimon and Colabello if they find guys that can clearly be an upgrade.

  12. #72
    Senior Member All-Star cmathewson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jokin View Post
    That was Ben's take, anyway. And since Christy is right that it was probably close between Gilmartin (1st rd pick) and Darnell (6th rd. pick), I take that as not a good sign that he has regained full health and/or effectiveness, for the present season, anyway. The Baseball Cube's analysis illustrates this concern and why the jury should be out given his 2 bad performance stints at AAA:


    Gilmartin's ratings:
    Control
    78
    K-Rating
    55
    Efficiency
    58
    vsPower
    37
    Health
    100

    Darnell's ratings:
    Control
    53
    K-Rating
    36
    Efficiency
    46
    vsPower
    58
    Health
    100
    Regarding Gilmartin's AA year in 2012, yes it wasn't bad, but I still go with "fair to middlin" as I would have expected a First Rd. pick and a top 200-type prospect to have done a little better than that. He still has a slightly better 5-year projection than Darnell (Darnell projects to average around a 5.10 ERA/4.90 FIP over 5 years and never topping 0.4 fWAR vs. Gilmartin with a 4.73 ERA/4.80 FIP), but clearly he needs to return to full health, and then he must still surpass all of those on the list in front of him.
    That's a good analysis. Perhaps the assignments are not all about ability.
    "If you'da been thinkin' you wouldn't 'a thought that.."

  13. #73
    Please ban me! All-Star stringer bell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jokin View Post
    Just some of them? and only if they need to do so?

    I get what they're trying to set up, but do they have a firm plan in place to not only pull the trigger, but the willingness to cut Barlett after what they've just gone through in justifying him being on the 25-man? I still say they can keep Bartlett and option Florimon and Colabello if they find guys that can clearly be an upgrade.
    I guess I hold Florimon as more valuable than you do. I don't think anyone will designate someone with more value than he has shown. Colabello, OTOH, isn't a proven major leaguer, AAA and spring training notwithstanding. Two spots on the 40-man--claim at least one guy to supplant someone on the current 25 man roster.

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