Some of these guys who run into shoulder issues after TJ just need to get on and stay on a strength and conditioning program and they are more or less ok. I know JJ was put on a shoulder strength program after he was shut down with shoulder issues in 2011 and came back strong for 2012, although his velocity did dip a little. There is risk there and a high ceiling too. It would be very un Twins like to bring a guy like JJ on board out of free agency but I would be pleasantly surprised if they did.
I like how people are quick to say that they knew something was wrong with Baker last year when Johnson typically misses a couple of starts a season and was shut down for most of one season due to arm issues. there is absolutely no way that the Twins should give a guy like Johnson a 4/75+ extension even if they didn't have to give up any prospects.
Only reason that the Twins would be in the bidding for Johnson is cause of his pending FA/arm troubles.
MN has NEVER been one to take a chance like this....so it will be interesting if they enter the bidding.
What will other teams offer up as a gamble for him. If its one high end prospect (Rosario or Arcia for ex) and a mid-tier (Benson or Hermsen) like ANA did for Grienke....its well worth the shot, even if they want a legit MLB player like Span or Revere. It is a HUGE gamble, but this team has never gone 'all in' & management may want to finally take a shot.
This makes no sense at all. Why would they choose this year? They have lost 90 games in two consecutive seasons and they need WAY MORE than JJ to be a good team.Quote:
but this team has never gone 'all in' & management may want to finally take a shot.
The best course of action is not doing anything to screw up the future. Things that will screw up the future is trading good prospects and signing average players to long contracts. For now the team needs to target guys on reasonable 2-3 yr deals like Willingham and it is going to have to take its lumps. Rebuilding awful teams doesn't happen in one offseason.
Also you aren't confusing me at all, champ. Keep trying to make me out to be the simpleton who doesn't understand baseball...it won't end well for ya.
Yes in 2011 he was hurt, but in the 3 years surrounding that he averaged over 190 IP, which actually is quite a bit more then ANY pitcher pitched for our 2012 Twins ;)
In 3 of the past 4 years he pitched either 200 IP or very close to that, yes, he isn't going to give you every start every year but as long as he gives you 28-30 I would certainly live with that, again give me the high risk, high reward.
[/QUOTE] never said that Johnson would be the "typical" Twins signing, in fact he would go against the grain quite a bit, which would actually be a good thing. Give me the high risk high reward signing of Josh Johnson rather then paying close to the same amount for the low risk low reward Shawn Marcum or the like. You were the one who said the Twins wouldn't give out a big contract to a player with injury history, I provided two examples of players they did give multi year deals to that had significant injury histories.
In 3 of the past 4 years he pitched either 200 IP or very close to that, yes, he isn't going to give you every start every year but as long as he gives you 28-30 I would certainly live with that, again give me the high risk, high reward.[/QUOTE]
If Marcum gets Josh Johnson kind of money you would have a point. He won't get that kind of money, so you don't have a point
The Twins farm system is bereft of starting pitching and middle infielders. The only trades that makes sense are ones where we deal from a position of strength or surplus, which means your only trade options are one of: Span / Revere / Hicks / Arcia or either Morneau / Parmelee. Trading Rosario would be a huge mistake in my book as he is the only legit MI prospect they have (don't even talk about Dozier, et al); they are marginal prospects with little chance of being plus major league players). Worsening holes in your system to plug other holes doesn't solve problems long term. If you can trade two of the above mentioned for long term pitching help (feel free to throw in marginal prospects), we have to make the deal. The likely return will not be a pitcher as good as Johnson or Shields but so long as they they are reliable and reasonably consistent then we have at least fixed one spot in the rotation. Then you still have to spend some money on reasonable 2 FA SP on 3 year deals to bridge the gap to the first class of real pitching prospects in our system. Only way to be competitive next year and still not mortgage the farm for the future.
"If Marcum gets Josh Johnson kind of money you would have a point. He won't get that kind of money, so you don't have a point"
Marcum will get 4 years at close to 13 mil a season this off season. I am advocating grabbing Johnson and paying him 17 million a year in an extension. Yes Johnson would cost more money, but the upside is so much greater and worth it.
Sitting back and thinking the moon and stars are going to align in some undefined magical year far off in the future is how you become the KC Royals. You're perpetually trading the present for the future, until one day you wake up and you realize you're 20 years into a 4 year rebuilding plan with nothing to show for it, and you're farther away than you were 20 years ago.
if they can get a Josh Johnson for a reasonable price, including trading some minor league assets, AND sign him to an extension, they absolutely should do so.
Oh...so getting is an ace is only a matter of trading marginal prospects and convincing them to take less money?
Well damn. Why don't we get five of them? Perhaps we should (dare I say) try this approach with middle infield as well? Do you think a bag of balls and two hot chicks will get us Elvis Andrus for the next 17 years?
Jesus offseason fan speculation can get obnoxious.
You make trades like a catcher for a closer, a tantalizing prospect, and a guy you were flat out wrong on.
The Twins have to figure outt how to develop pitchers. Why would a free agent come here at this time? One would be that they were offered more here than anywhere else. Two would be they did not get an offer they like and had good numbers when pitching a Target Field so a year pitching there would get them a better paycheck. Three is no one else would sign them. Four is they believe they can carry a team to a championship and what better team than the Twins? The least likely of them all for a reason they would sign here: I lived here when I was real young so I am going to sign for a huge discount.