02-08-2013, 11:30 PM #101
02-08-2013, 11:36 PM #102
"Consolidate in 2013" Exactly what was consolidated? Two new OFers with no assurance that any of them (including Willingham) will be there in 2015 (the "compete year"). Of the MLB-experienced pitchers acquired this off-season only one is anticipated to be in the rotation in 2015. This would increase the planned players to two. The entire INF could be changed for 2015. Flux would be a closer description for 2013 than consolidate.
"Movement in 2014"--this statement is vague. In a Polyanna-ish view it means a repeat of the 2001 season. It could also mean when the FO expels the rest of the feces from the Active Roster, or anything in-betweenthe two statements.
"Compete in 2015"--we all hope that this occurs, but the 2012 season and its' off-season make this more of a wish than an expectation.
Not signing Saunders "clears a path" for the Twins to give Blackburn another shot--Nishioka got one last year--and Blackburn had demonstrated some success in years past, as opposed to you-know-who.
02-09-2013, 01:23 AM #103
02-09-2013, 03:21 AM #104
I am willing to group with anyone who is a fellow Twins fan, but I wish that there was more baseball talk and less bickering.
I was hoping for Saunders, but life goes on and it may turn out that we are better off without him.
02-09-2013, 07:41 AM #105
02-09-2013, 07:56 AM #106
02-09-2013, 08:28 AM #107
By movement in 2014 I mean sorting out the above and starting to make a legitimate jump in the standings to the 80s in wins. Might have to sign an actual free agent or make a trade if some of the people listed above flop. Arica/May/Meyer/(maybe first round pick this year) should start to be a part of the squad and potentially Sano if he truly is a beast.
Competition in 2015 is all of this coming together, especially the pitching.
I concede this is a little optimistic but I still see it as a reasonable outcome. If everything falls apart this year and none of those players prove they can be big leaguers, it will be a much longer rebuild.Papers...business papers.
02-09-2013, 08:38 AM #108
You never have enough pitching.
For all the want of giving Blackburn another shot, he is still going to be delayed with an injury and not on the 40-man. If he returns, someone has to go. Same if you add any of the group of Walters, Deduno, Vasquez, Elarton and especially Harden.
Right now it looks like the Twins MAY start the season with Diamond and Swarzak on the DL.
We won't know the state of Gibson and Pelfrey until the season begins.
est, but is a Pressly or a Wood or a Roeincke anything more than a spot holder on a roster that a (forgive me) Capps, Rauch or even Hawkins would fill for the same price, but with more experience.
Overall, I dream about rebuilding a team from within, but go look at the Twins draft cycles and see how many actually make an impact. More impact is made via adding players by trading veterans, it often seems. And you do have to dip into the free agent pool when able.
Target Field was going to make the Twins able to dip into the Free Agent pool as well as keep their own players (i.e. overpay for future performance).
02-09-2013, 08:43 AM #109
02-09-2013, 10:42 AM #110
Seriously though, I think the is the more realist approach that is kind of the line where optimists and pessimists are falling on each side of the fence. I agree with you. I'm not sold that all the guys slated to start the year in the rotation will stay off the DL to start the year, which is why depth is indeed a wonderful thing. If only the depth was composed of more competent major league pitching. My gut feeling is out of diamond, Worley, pelfrey, and Gibson, at least one is not in the opening day rotation (most likely Gibson). Then there's the Swarzak and Blackburn injuries to consider.
edit. Just saw the diamond article maybe not being ready. Well super.
Last edited by edavis0308; 02-09-2013 at 11:10 AM.
02-09-2013, 11:02 AM #111
02-09-2013, 11:06 AM #112
02-09-2013, 11:29 AM #113
The board has been discussing Saunders for quite some time and the merits of signing him or not, this thread began with the news of his signing with the Mariners and subsequently evolved with various opinions on whether it was good or bad for the team, whether it mattered or not, why it mattered, how it represented a further failure and dishonesty from our FO and a host of other viewpoints.
Then along comes Twerp, who had no opinion on the issue but does have one about people who are disappointed and disallusioned by yet another lost opportunity, and procedes to call them "the worst type of human being", so just a negative opinion on negative opinions. What exactly did the post contribute to the original subject?
So, who began the bickering? Who decided to make things personal and insult people who are unhappy about it and somehow decide they are less than fans? Yet somehow the people who then respond to this garbage are the bad guys. If all those decrying the response to Twerps comments have such high standards for this board then let's at least direct the displeasure in the appropriate place.
02-09-2013, 01:16 PM #114
02-09-2013, 01:17 PM #115
02-09-2013, 02:17 PM #116
02-09-2013, 02:21 PM #117
As far as Saunders go, it would have been nice to have him, but going much more then 1/7 mil on him wouldn't be a very good move IMO. (Yes, Yes I know we have 20 mil left) but there is never a good reason to over pay greatly for mediocrity. It's clear Saunders preferred to play for the Mariners who have (had) a pitchers park and actually appear like they can contend this year. Sure the Twins could have came in and gave him 1 year 9-10 mil to get him in Minnesota but I think that ends up hurting them in the long run as it sort of skews the market prices for pitchers heading into 2014 (if that makes sense?)
At this point, let's roll with what we have, I am sure there will be some more waiver pick ups, cuts in spring training that we can bring in as wlel. For some reason when expectations are at an all time low this team defies them, its when expectations are sky high they break our heart. Let's see what we got this year, maybe we can surprise folks, maybe we suck, either way gear up for a nice run in 2014-2016 when guys like Meyer, Arcia, May, Hicks, an co are all coming up.
02-09-2013, 04:58 PM #118
And as twinsnorth suggested, you're now directing this at me because of your own bad blood rather than at the real culprit in this thread. Which seems like it is becoming more and more prevalent. Other than Bonnes recent little poem-play - anyone with pessimism who is attacked you look the other way. Any time someone with optimism is attacked you come riding in with this high and mighty crap. The vibe around here is essentially that you and others are endorsing unfair criticism on people not feeling good aobut this season and are quick to give these lectures to anyone who responds.
Talk about condescending.
02-09-2013, 05:05 PM #119
It's like in football...the guy who takes the shot first, gets away with it.
Or, you know, maybe it's a matter of ignoring the person who takes the first shot because they agree with what he said (regardless of how he said it..and in Twerps case, extremely, over-the-top rude...deserving of getting completely slammed) and instead criticizing the people who take offense to such an offensive childish post.
02-09-2013, 07:42 PM #120