Thread: Revere's Plate Discipline

My biggest hope for Revere is he ends up being Juan Pierre with a few less stolen bases but a little better defensively. He can be the stop gap CF until Hicks is ready, at that point you either trade him or keep him around as a nice 4th OF.

Originally Posted by Fanatic Jack

I'm just curious where are all the bloggers who personally attacked Ben Revere last year saying he did not hit for a high enough average and was unable to get on base. Most of them nearly had a heart attack when Span was traded to the Nationals at the deadline last year. I wonder if they need to be called out or if they will just admit they were wrong.

Less than half a season of .338 BABIP ball with little power isn't proving anyone wrong. Like Fro said, if that BABIP drops to even .320 and Revere dips down to under a .700 OPS, those doubters weren't wrong. Revere suddenly turns into a punchless OFer with great defense, which is what most of the doubters feared was his ceiling.

I'm very hopeful about Revere's progression and how he's been playing this season but let's not start declaring him the center fielder of the future quite yet. Ben's play has made me think that trading Span is a good idea but there's still a risk there. Revere could regress at any moment and then the Twins are in a pretty tight spot.

By the way, Revere posted a .704 OPS in June and a .662 OPS in July (SSS, obviously). Those numbers aren't proving any doubters wrong. Without his .799 OPS in May, his numbers are entirely pedestrian. Still, he's made progress and we should be happy about that. It makes trading Span a lot easier pill to swallow.

Rocketpig,

Who cares about Revere's OPS. His job is to get on base (By hitting, making contact, or drawing walks), steal bases, score runs, ignite the offense, and provide great defense in the outfield. People make too much of him not hitting for power. Sure it would be great if Revere could sprinkle in a few more doubles and triples. However, with his speed he turns infield hits into doubles and triples. His range is so good in centerfield that it makes his arm not even a issue. He is much better, cheaper, and more durable than Span. Span is expendable!!!

Originally Posted by Fanatic Jack

Rocketpig,

Who cares about Revere's OPS. His job is to get on base (By hitting, making contact, or drawing walks), steal bases, score runs, ignite the offense, and provide great defense in the outfield. People make too much of him not hitting for power. Sure it would be great if Revere could sprinkle in a few more doubles and triples. However, with his speed he turns infield hits into doubles and triples. His range is so good in centerfield that it makes his arm not even a issue. He is much better, cheaper, and more durable than Span. Span is expendable!!!

Which is why I said I'm hopeful about Revere but let's not pretend that it's not possible for him to backslide. Speedy guys without historically strong OBP skills walk a very fine line. Their BABIP drops and suddenly they're a marginal player. They suffer even a minor lower body injury and suddenly they're a marginal player. Pitchers adjust to them and suddenly they're a marginal player.

I'm hoping that won't happen to Revere (otherwise I wouldn't be advocating a trade of Span) but it's a possibility. It happens to "hit it on the ground and burn to first" players in their early to mid 20s all the time.

Originally Posted by rocketpig

Which is why I said I'm hopeful about Revere but let's not pretend that it's not possible for him to backslide. Speedy guys without historically strong OBP skills walk a very fine line. Their BABIP drops and suddenly they're a marginal player. They suffer even a minor lower body injury and suddenly they're a marginal player. Pitchers adjust to them and suddenly they're a marginal player.

I'm hoping that won't happen to Revere (otherwise I wouldn't be advocating a trade of Span) but it's a possibility. It happens to "hit it on the ground and burn to first" players in their early to mid 20s all the time.

Come on, Pig, all he has to do is "ignite the offense". And he "turns infield singles into doubles and triples"! Insert other generic platitude here!

Originally Posted by Fanatic Jack

Rocketpig,

Who cares about Revere's OPS. His job is to get on base (By hitting, making contact, or drawing walks), steal bases, score runs, ignite the offense, and provide great defense in the outfield. People make too much of him not hitting for power. Sure it would be great if Revere could sprinkle in a few more doubles and triples. However, with his speed he turns infield hits into doubles and triples. His range is so good in centerfield that it makes his arm not even a issue. He is much better, cheaper, and more durable than Span. Span is expendable!!!

A single and a steal does not equal a double if there are runners on base at the time. A double with a runner on second will usually result in a run scored. A single and a steal with a man on second will probably result in zero runs and runners on second and third. Call me crazy, but I prefer the actual double.

Ben has exceeded everyones hope but the problem is gonna be that he is only as valuable as his batting average. That can be dangerous, but so far this year, so good.
With Benson, Arcia & Hicks all about ready (give or take) & Buxton possibly a couple yrs out (#2 picks should make majors in 3/4 yrs IMO), Ben could be a 4th OF....but a very valuable one.

Ben could eventually be pushed out by our prospects in the future. Although... Hes a Gardy type of player and it may not happen under Gardenhire. I don't know.

However... Those players are not here right now. This is the 2012 Twins and Ben is without question a 2012 starter.

I'm enjoying watching him play ball and I can't understand how others don't feel the same. This guy plays baseball how it's supposed to be played. I really don't recall seeing any player like him for quite some time.

That catch he almost made tonight would have given him another MLB play of the year award. The play he made on Vlad last year that gave him the award last year was beyond words. Sensational catch after sensational catch. .300 hitter.

This kid can put some butts in the seats.

Are doubles really the sticking point for the anti Revere crowd. It alludes me.

In the past half year I have been a sometimes vocal opponent of Ben Revere, I now must back River Brian in the fact that Revere is a magic maker, a shaman of baseball.

This young man might not have the greatest abilities when it comes to stereotypical baseball performance, but he is magic on the field and seemingly brings it on a day in and day out basis. He will not accrue many assists as an outfielder, he will not hit many extra-base hits at the plate.

This kid will play a gold glove outfield without a good arm, he will hit near .300 without any pop, and he will steal a ton of bases.

Ben Revere has a magic quality to him, and he will succeed. He is baseball... and a reminder why I love this game.

... He brings excitement!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I was about 6 ft away from that ol ball catch he almost made tonight. He really got o or that. I was amazed.

Originally Posted by John Bonnes

I was about 6 ft away from that ol ball catch he almost made tonight. He really got o or that. I was amazed.

So close... Just getting a glove on that ball is amazing enough. Decades will have to pass before you see a catch like that. So close!!!

How many players would even attempt it?
Of those... How many players could even get a glove on it?

That catch... If made... Would have been one of the best ever. You were 6 feet from almost seeing something historical.

If only he could have hung on. What an effort.

His catch last year on Vlad has to rank as one of the best ever. Twins Fans... hopefully... are starting to realize what this kid can do and hopefully appreciate it.

Ben Revere....leading the league in Magical Almosts

Originally Posted by TheLeviathan

Ben Revere....leading the league in Magical Almosts

But if he makes that catch, (obviously one of the best of ALL TIME!) I bet Oakland just forfeits the game out of respect!

Originally Posted by FrodaddyG

But if he makes that catch, (obviously one of the best of ALL TIME!) I bet Oakland just forfeits the game out of respect!

Yeah... I got that coming. God forbid anyone should have a positive comment. My fault... Carry on pointing out every players flaws. That seems to come more naturally.

I just reviewed the tape on the attempted catch. I miss assessed it... It was a substandard effort. Not worth mentioning when we can razor focus on throwing arms and stats vs left handers at night in throwback jerseys.

It was a great effort. Hyperventilating over a non-catch starts to look silly - it reveals that you're looking for his successes only and not his failures. That non-catch was not a failure, but he has many other failing aspects of his game that are concerning. He's having a hell of a 2012 though, I hope it continues to trend upward.

Originally Posted by TheLeviathan

It was a great effort. Hyperventilating over a non-catch starts to look silly - it reveals that you're looking for his successes only and not his failures. That non-catch was not a failure, but he has many other failing aspects of his game that are concerning. He's having a hell of a 2012 though, I hope it continues to trend upward.

What Failures? After you answer that. Name a player that doesn't have any!!!

You call it hyperventilating... OK... I was saying... So Close... If he catches that... It would have been... Was I wrong?

Originally Posted by Riverbrian

What Failures? After you answer that. Name a player that doesn't have any!!!

You call it hyperventilating... OK... I was saying... So Close... If he catches that... It would have been... Was I wrong?

A complete lack of pop and the inability to draw a walk would be two large ones. Specifically the drawing a walk portion for a guy who should be a table setter, and relies entirely on batting average, which is a department he has been fortunate in to this point in the season.

Originally Posted by FrodaddyG

A complete lack of pop and the inability to draw a walk would be two large ones. Specifically the drawing a walk portion for a guy who should be a table setter, and relies entirely on batting average, which is a department he has been fortunate in to this point in the season.

OK... I agree... and lets not forget about his arm.

Now Name a player that doesn't have any failures!!!

Originally Posted by Riverbrian

OK... I agree... Now Name a player that doesn't have any failures!!!

That isn't the point. It's the most players' successes aren't as exclusively tied to one tool as Revere's are, in this case, his speed. Hoping dribblers continue to find holes every AB isn't a great way to expect sustained productivity. As has been pointed out before, one mild hamstring tweak or any dropoff in speed and Revere is essentially a useless player.