View Poll Results: Should the Twins move on with Ron Gardenhire?
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05-12-2012, 01:47 PM #41
I'm not anti-Gardenhire and I don't understand the extreme disdain for him. I don't blame him for playoff failures. Only a handful of teams have reached the playoffs and the number is less in the AL Central because the Twins have taken the Central Title so many times while he has been employed. I don't blame Gardenhire for playing in the AL Central and refuse to use that against him.
There is very little reason to focus on the day by day game management when assessing Ron Gardenhire as a Manager? All Manager's have Hitting Charts, All Managers have stop watches, pitch counts and very similiar gut feelings. Some managers can get more out of their players but it's still the players who have to get more out of themselves. It's a game of inches and momentum. In the end, the manager can only lead the horses to water. This part of the discussion is really kind of silly.
What needs to be discussed is this... Gardy's role in picking the horses that he leads to the water!!!
Gardy's role with what is going on is in the area of player evaluation!!! Here are the questions that need to be answered. Does Gardenhire have a vote in the process? Did Garza(for example) get traded because Gardy advocated his departure for more offense? Did Gardy personally advocate keeping other pitchers in the organization over Garza? Did Gardy feel the need for more offense and communicate this strongly to the Bill Smith who acted on his behalf? Did Gardy advocate the acquiring of more offense? Was Gardy against the trading of Garza? Did Bill Smith feel the team had enough pitching against Gardy's opinion? (I'm only using Garza for example... The current problems are deeper then Garza).
The current situation is upon us because of multiple people and the bottom line is that the Owners are at the top of the food chain. The Owners hire the people who hire the people. If your organization is in tough shape... The Owners are responsible.
Gardy was part of the process that delivered some fantastic AL Central play for a nice period of time. He is currently part of the process that is delivering some of the worst Major League Baseball.
The organization is in a hole... How did it get there? Gardy I assume was part of the process and still is. How did the process change when Ryan stepped down and Bill Smith took over. Did the evaluation balance get out of whack when Ryan left. Maybe Ryan and Gardy were good balance for each other. Maybe Ryan knew when to listen to Gardy and when to trust his own judgement. Maybe Smith wasn't the type to accept Gardy's opinion's or Maybe Smith didn't trust his judgement and started relying on Gardy's judgement more then Ryan did. A lot of Maybe's and I have no way of knowing. However, the assessment process works, it was doing fine and then it went to hell. Gardy is part of that process I assume... Good and Bad.
Something Changed and now the organization needs desperate change. Gardy has to go and I think he should get more then a hallmark card when he does. He deserves our respect for his role in bringing us the many AL Central Titles. If Gardy hasn't been heard for the past decade. He get's no blame at all but then he's to blame for not being forceful enough. I'm pro-Gardenhire but the times they are a changin.
Gameday Management is the goofiest argument for being Anti-Gardenhire.
Last edited by Riverbrian; 05-12-2012 at 01:50 PM.
05-12-2012, 01:59 PM #42
05-12-2012, 02:44 PM #43
I wouldn't have traded Gomez for Hardy in the 1st place. Gomez wasn't ready for the majors! Gomez has extreme talent! He just didn't have the head yet.
After the Santana trade, he was forced into the lineup before he was ready. He sprung past Span on the depth chart and I assume it was because someone felt that someone had to show up and be a major league representative for what we got in return.
Hardy was always an injury risk. That being said... After the 1st bad trade was made acquiring Hardy... Trading Hardy for nothing to the Orioles was the next bad trade and much worse then the first.
The Bill Smith Era was directionally lost and a series of over-reactions. Was this because Gardy had more or less influence over the roster after Ryan left? Or did he have the same? I don't know. I assume that Gardy has some influence.