Jump to content

Providing independent coverage of the Minnesota Twins.
Subscribe to Twins Daily Email

The Store

Photo

Miller: Twins Ticket Sales "Muted"

  • Please log in to reply
79 replies to this topic

#1 John Bonnes

John Bonnes

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 253 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 10:35 AM

Phil Miller finds out from Dave St. Peter that the first day of single game ticket sales wasn't great, but St. Peter doesn't see too precipitous of a drop:

Still, the Twins sold 50,000 tickets on Saturday, St. Peter said, and have moved more than 1.8 million for the season. They remain on pace, St. Peter said, for the equivalent of 19,000 season tickets sold.

"We remain confident we'll continue to be one of the best-drawing teams in baseball," St. Peter said.


That confidence would seem to be misplaced. Last year, the Twins drew 2.77 million - and ranked 12th overall. Last year, the dividing line between the top 15 and bottom 15 was about 2.35M. Would the Twins sink that low?

Consider that season ticket sales have gone down from 25,000 to 19,000, which is a 24% drop. A similar drop in overall sales would put the twins at 2.1 million this year.

Early indications show decreased demand for Twins tickets | StarTribune.com

#2 mcrow

mcrow

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 275 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 10:38 AM

Would serve them right by stuffing money in their pockets and putting out a poor quality product. As loyal as Twins fans are eventually they will stop paying to see this team.

#3 Oldgoat_MN

Oldgoat_MN

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 666 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 11:27 AM

One thing I do not understand about the business side of baseball is how they can put bad product on the field several years in a row.
The Orioles had a great season in 2012, but had a hell of a time getting people to come out to the ballpark. Although attendance jumped in the second half, the results were well below average for the year. They had not been competitive for years and lost fans.
Once fans stop coming to the park it is difficult to get them to start coming out again.
Putting a non-competitive team on the field 3 years in a row can be very, very costly.

#4 Willihammer

Willihammer

    ice cream correspondent

  • Members
  • 2,800 posts
  • LocationSaint Paul

Posted 18 February 2013 - 11:28 AM

This 81% figure came up again on your podcast this week John. Maybe St Peter arrived at that figure because some people changed their plans from full season to partial-season, and thus aren't counted in your 19,000 figure of full-season ticket sales above?

#5 FrodaddyG

FrodaddyG

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 536 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 11:30 AM

This 81% figure came up again on your podcast this week John. Maybe St Peter arrived at that figure because some people changed their plans from full season to partial-season, and thus aren't counted in your 19,000 figure of full-season ticket sales above?

I'd imagine the "equivalent of" 19,000 full season tickets would incorporate the partial season ticket packages used as some percentage of a "full season" package.

#6 Willihammer

Willihammer

    ice cream correspondent

  • Members
  • 2,800 posts
  • LocationSaint Paul

Posted 18 February 2013 - 11:45 AM

That would make sense. Must be that 81% of season "ticketholders" renewed, but actual sales were only 76% compared to last year.

#7 Brock Beauchamp

Brock Beauchamp

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 8,419 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 12:34 PM

One thing I do not understand about the business side of baseball is how they can put bad product on the field several years in a row.
The Orioles had a great season in 2012, but had a hell of a time getting people to come out to the ballpark. Although attendance jumped in the second half, the results were well below average for the year. They had not been competitive for years and lost fans.
Once fans stop coming to the park it is difficult to get them to start coming out again.
Putting a non-competitive team on the field 3 years in a row can be very, very costly.


I've been saying this for awhile. It took ten years to build up the goodwill this team has with fans and now they're pissing it away.

But there's no changing it now. They made their bed.

#8 mike wants wins

mike wants wins

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 5,767 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 12:42 PM

If I was governor, I'd push for a law requiring the Twins to pay the state and county for every dollar below the last year on the dome, adjusted for baseball inflation. They wanted money, if they won't spend it, pay back the taxpayers.......

I hope no one goes this year, if they are bad again. It is the only power we have to get changes made.
Lighten up Francis....

#9 John Bonnes

John Bonnes

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 253 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 01:55 PM

This 81% figure came up again on your podcast this week John. Maybe St Peter arrived at that figure because some people changed their plans from full season to partial-season, and thus aren't counted in your 19,000 figure of full-season ticket sales above?


Yeah, I thought of that as we were wrapping up that discussion, bue decided to move on. I suspect the difference is people downgrading their ticket packages.

I suspect that amount is more than the 5% difference between 19% annd 24%. At the media luncheon before twins fest, St. Peter said the season ticket sales were about 18,000, and that's about when he said 81% renewal, too. That would be 28%. And that also doesn't take into account any new season ticket holders.

#10 drjim

drjim

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 1,902 posts
  • LocationSt. Paul

Posted 18 February 2013 - 04:07 PM

If only they signed Saunders, Marcum and another middle infielder - ticket sales would be through the roof!

#11 drjim

drjim

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 1,902 posts
  • LocationSt. Paul

Posted 18 February 2013 - 04:11 PM

If I was governor, I'd push for a law requiring the Twins to pay the state and county for every dollar below the last year on the dome, adjusted for baseball inflation. They wanted money, if they won't spend it, pay back the taxpayers.......

I hope no one goes this year, if they are bad again. It is the only power we have to get changes made.


Two problems. The state didn't contribute any money and payroll is higher than the last year in the Dome.

#12 snepp

snepp

    Speediest Moderator

  • Twins Moderators
  • 4,117 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 04:11 PM

If only they signed Saunders, Marcum and another middle infielder - ticket sales would be through the roof!


Yup, putting a better team on the field would be disastrous for attendance, both now, and in the future. Those marginal upgrades couldn't possibly help one bit.
"Maybe you could go grab a bat and ball… and learn something. Maybe you will get it."
- Strib commenter educating the elitists on the value of RBI's

#13 CRArko

CRArko

    Prestidigitator

  • Members
  • 1,246 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 04:20 PM

If I was governor, I'd push for a law requiring the Twins to pay the state and county for every dollar below the last year on the dome, adjusted for baseball inflation. They wanted money, if they won't spend it, pay back the taxpayers.......

I hope no one goes this year, if they are bad again. It is the only power we have to get changes made.


Well, I plan to attend a few games this year. Sorry if that offends anyone's tender and delicate sensibilities.

Okay, I'm really not sorry.

#14 mike wants wins

mike wants wins

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 5,767 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 04:21 PM

Adjusted for baseball inflation...ok, give the money to the county.

#15 mike wants wins

mike wants wins

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 5,767 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 04:21 PM

Why would that offend me?

#16 twinsnorth49

twinsnorth49

    Twins Moderator

  • Twins Moderators
  • 3,679 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 04:39 PM

If only they signed Saunders, Marcum and another middle infielder - ticket sales would be through the roof!


You're right, it was a good decision not to do anything the fans might want to buy tickets to see. I guess if the Twins are content to just wait for the future, I'll wait until then as well.

#17 Brock Beauchamp

Brock Beauchamp

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 8,419 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 05:35 PM

If only they signed Saunders, Marcum and another middle infielder - ticket sales would be through the roof!


How long you gonna keep banging that drum?

#18 drjim

drjim

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 1,902 posts
  • LocationSt. Paul

Posted 18 February 2013 - 05:40 PM

How long you gonna keep banging that drum?


Probably as long as people think any of those moves would make much of a difference in attendance this year.

I agree with you that they made their bed, but only in the sense that they have sucked the past two years and the organization is in pretty bad shape as far as young talent in the majors is concerned. That is what keeps people away, not signing Correia instead of Saunders or Marcum.

#19 Rosterman

Rosterman

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 981 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 05:46 PM

Let's see if the Tins p.r. machine can spark some interest and that someone like Hicks makes us want to see the Twins try and win in 2013. I don't think the return of Bruno and Steinbach should be a Twins 2013 selling point.
Joel Thingvall
www.thingvall.com
rosterman at www.twinscards.com

#20 silverslugger

silverslugger

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 115 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 05:50 PM

I was able to attend my first game at Target Field last July. My wife bought tickets in early April, back when some still thought they had a chance for a bounce back year, at face value. I'd like to go to a game again this year. We won't be dumb enough to pay face value as I'm relatively certain their will be an abundance of tickets available on the secondary market by July.

#21 TheLeviathan

TheLeviathan

    Twins News Team

  • Twins News Team
  • 4,905 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 05:54 PM

I would imagine by August you'll be able to pay between 10-25% of face value. And, as a former season ticket holder, I can tell you prices like that will drive season ticket holders away which will hurt the team's available budget.

A few of those "marginal" upgrades were not only 2013 investments, they were investments in the 2015-217 fanbase as well.

#22 FrodaddyG

FrodaddyG

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 536 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 05:58 PM

Probably as long as people think any of those moves would make much of a difference in attendance this year.

I agree with you that they made their bed, but only in the sense that they have sucked the past two years and the organization is in pretty bad shape as far as young talent in the majors is concerned. That is what keeps people away, not signing Correia instead of Saunders or Marcum.

Yep, why even try to get better in any increment and give people the hope that if they are on the fence about going to a game that the team they could go see will be acceptably decent? Hell, why sign Correia or anybody at all? 25 minimum salaries or bust! It doesn't matter!

#23 Willihammer

Willihammer

    ice cream correspondent

  • Members
  • 2,800 posts
  • LocationSaint Paul

Posted 18 February 2013 - 05:58 PM

Am I the only one that thinks these figures seem high?

#24 twinsnorth49

twinsnorth49

    Twins Moderator

  • Twins Moderators
  • 3,679 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 06:15 PM

Probably as long as people think any of those moves would make much of a difference in attendance this year.

I agree with you that they made their bed, but only in the sense that they have sucked the past two years and the organization is in pretty bad shape as far as young talent in the majors is concerned. That is what keeps people away, not signing Correia instead of Saunders or Marcum.


No, sucking the past two years, not much young, MLB ready talent, razor thin SP and doing absolutely NOTHING to address it, despite ample funds and opportunity, from a paying customers perspective, is what keeps people away.

#25 drjim

drjim

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 1,902 posts
  • LocationSt. Paul

Posted 18 February 2013 - 06:19 PM

Yep, why even try to get better in any increment and give people the hope that if they are on the fence about going to a game that the team they could go see will be acceptably decent? Hell, why sign Correia or anybody at all? 25 minimum salaries or bust! It doesn't matter!


They did bring in three new starters and a couple of bullpen arms. I think they are trying to get better while also balancing against avoiding bad contracts and not blocking young players.

I understand people don't like the Correia signing - I don't either! But to take a decrease in season tickets sales and to suggest the reason is because of some pet signing they didn't do is absurd.

Edited by drjim, 18 February 2013 - 06:22 PM.


#26 TheLeviathan

TheLeviathan

    Twins News Team

  • Twins News Team
  • 4,905 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 06:23 PM

I understand people don't lime the Correia signing -but I don't either! But to take a decrease in season tickets sales and to suggest the reason is because of some pet signing they didn't do is absurd.


Ticket sales are linked to fan enthusiasm. This offseason gave the fanbase ZERO reason to be enthusiastic about next year. So you can cherry pick any names you want to say "that guy wouldn't have done it" but it's intentionally missing the entire point.

#27 drjim

drjim

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 1,902 posts
  • LocationSt. Paul

Posted 18 February 2013 - 06:27 PM

No, sucking the past two years, not much young, MLB ready talent, razor thin SP and doing absolutely NOTHING to address it, despite ample funds and opportunity, from a paying customers perspective, is what keeps people away.


If you think adding three new starters to the opening day rotation is nothing I don't know what to say. I agree that the upgrade could have been marginally better with McCarthy or Marcum but to virtually all fans that difference really wouldn't register and certainly wouldn't impact decisions to buy tickets.

#28 twinsnorth49

twinsnorth49

    Twins Moderator

  • Twins Moderators
  • 3,679 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 06:31 PM

They did bring in three new starters and a couple of bullpen arms. I think they are trying to get better while also balancing against avoiding bad contracts and not blocking young players.

I understand people don't like the Correia signing - I don't either! But to take a decrease in season tickets sales and to suggest the reason is because of some pet signing they didn't do is absurd.


Ok, I'll agree the performance on the field the last 2 years plays a role in the decrease, but thinking the Twins doing pretty much nil to address that in the interim, despite said pathetic performance, is beyond absurd.

#29 drjim

drjim

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 1,902 posts
  • LocationSt. Paul

Posted 18 February 2013 - 06:32 PM

Ticket sales are linked to fan enthusiasm. This offseason gave the fanbase ZERO reason to be enthusiastic about next year. So you can cherry pick any names you want to say "that guy wouldn't have done it" but it's intentionally missing the entire point.


I disagree. I think the bigger point is there was very little Terry Ryan and the front office could have done this offseason to change fan enthusiasm and the overall ticket sales trend.

The names I "cherry picked" were the very guys we have been talking about all offseason.

#30 TheLeviathan

TheLeviathan

    Twins News Team

  • Twins News Team
  • 4,905 posts

Posted 18 February 2013 - 06:33 PM

Ok, I'll agree the performance on the field the last 2 years plays a role in the decrease, but thinking the Twins doing pretty much nil to address that in the interim, despite said pathetic performance, is beyond absurd.


Marginally absurd. Because apparently "significant" = "marginal"