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Article: Roster Projections Part 1b: Infielders and Outfielders

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#1 Seth Stohs

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 03:39 AM

You can view the page at http://twinsdaily.co...and-Outfielders

#2 johnnydakota

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 04:36 AM

I wonder if the twins will pickup Tony Campana?

#3 tjsyam921

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 06:05 AM

That's what I figure as well. If Benson has a good spring he'll get the spot over Hicks to start the year because of his september call up in 2011. But will he start in center or as a 4th outfielder?

#4 beckmt

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 06:35 AM

Benson will have to start or be in Rochester. Think Hicks will be the CF and leadoff hitter. Boggs could be the fourth outfileder for the start. In the end Parmalee is the key as to how this plays out.

#5 MWLFan

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 07:51 AM

My first reaction after reading your projection was...thats the best we have. I felt like all the people at the beginning of Major League looking over the roster and saying who are these guys. But it really hits home how many retreads and AAAA players are going to filling out the roster to start the season. I just hope July and August we have really started the youth movement in earnest. I don't want to slam guys because these are players trying their best and working hard to improve everyday out there. But heart and sweat can only take you so far in baseball, sooner or later you need some talent. That talent is coming, but we are still a year or so from it. It is like 1982-83 for me, to quote Yogi it is Deja Vu all over again.

#6 jorgenswest

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 08:22 AM

I wish it was more like 82-83. The current roster has too many decline phase players that will not be part of the solution.

I think there is a good chance that either the 6th infielder or 4th outfielder will be a player who is not in the organization yet.

#7 fairweather

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 09:18 AM

Why won't Drew Butera go away? What a waste of a roster spot.

#8 mcrow

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 10:37 AM

Pretty much seems like most of these spots are penciled in for the most part. I think the one thing to watch is Hicks/Benson. I think they want to take it easy with Hicks and not toss him in there if he's off to a slow start.

#9 Seth Stohs

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 10:41 AM

Pretty much seems like most of these spots are penciled in for the most part. I think the one thing to watch is Hicks/Benson. I think they want to take it easy with Hicks and not toss him in there if he's off to a slow start.


Agreed. They're not going to put him into a situation that they don't think he's ready for or could handle. They certainly believe in him. But the part that we don't see will also factor into that. He may hit .220 in spring training, but may be doing the right things in practice. Since Spring Training results should never be the final determinant (although it often is), other factors have to come in to play.

#10 MWLFan

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 10:47 AM

I wish it was more like 82-83. The current roster has too many decline phase players that will not be part of the solution.

I think there is a good chance that either the 6th infielder or 4th outfielder will be a player who is not in the organization yet.


1982 Roster that would go on to lose 100 games included such players as Gary Ward, Jesus Vega, Rob Wilfong, Larry Milbourbne, Ray Smith, Fernando Arroyo, Don Cooper, Doug Corbett, Pete "Freeze" Filson. So the quality of the players overall in 1982 was not overwhelming. Now the difference is that 1982 opening day lineup was also a youth movement with Gaetti, Hrbek, Eisenriech in the starting 9 mixed with vets like Smalley, Wyneger, Dave Engle, Mickey "your so fine" Hatcher. Much deeper then what we anticipate this year. But other names that came up that year and got playing time-Viola, Laudner, Bush. So the core of the 1987-91 teams started to learn in this year. The age of the guys- Herbie was 21 on opening day (jumping AAA I believe), Viola was 22, G-man was 23 and Bush 23. In 1983 a 22 year old named Greg Gagne showed up and we had our Shortstop for the next decade. And all this took place in a brand new Ball park. Maybe we will be surprised in the names coming out spring training.

#11 Bombo Rivera

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 10:47 AM

Willingham and Parmlee in the same starting OF? They are not going to cover much ground. With the Twins pitching staff they might have to utilize the softball defense of 4 OFers anyway. Better have whoever plays CF wear track shoes.

#12 cmathewson

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 11:10 AM

Shocked that the two guys Ryan has penciled in for SS and CF are not even 75% chances. I would say Florimon is close to 90%. He was the starting SS for the last two months last year after all. Nothing has changed since then. And I'd say it's Hicks' job to lose. Consider how they handled Mauer after trading Pierzinski. That is exactly Hick's situation now. He'd have to show some serious flaws to be sent down, imho.

#13 East Coast Twin

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 11:12 AM

Herbie was 21 on opening day (jumping AAA I believe) . . . .


Herbek actually jumped from A ball to the majors as did Eisenreich, which is pretty amazing. Gaetti jumped from AA. Viola was drafted in 1981 and made his major league debut within a year. Laudner was draft in 1979 and made his major league debut two years later.

The Griffith regime had a little different philosophy about promoting prospects through the system.

#14 LewFordLives

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 11:50 AM

Willingham and Parmlee in the same starting OF? They are not going to cover much ground. With the Twins pitching staff they might have to utilize the softball defense of 4 OFers anyway. Better have whoever plays CF wear track shoes.


I think Bombo raises a good point. We know Gardenhire likes speed in the outfield. By the end of May, it wouldn't shock me if Willingham and/or Parmelee is relegated to DH duties and the combination of Mastroianni, Hicks, Benson is holding down at least two spots in the outfield.

#15 mcrow

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 11:55 AM

I think Bombo raises a good point. We know Gardenhire likes speed in the outfield. By the end of May, it wouldn't shock me if Willingham and/or Parmelee is relegated to DH duties and the combination of Mastroianni, Hicks, Benson is holding down at least two spots in the outfield.


I highly doubt that. If you have Willingham or Parmelee added to the DH mix then you hvae difficulty getting Mauer time at DH and you'd have to sit Doumit more. They're best served as a team if they can have all 4 of these guys in the lineup as much as possible.

#16 LewFordLives

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 12:17 PM

When the starting pitching gets lit up, the first thing Gardy is going to do is blame the outfield defense.

#17 mcrow

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 01:05 PM

When the starting pitching gets lit up, the first thing Gardy is going to do is blame the outfield defense.


I don't think so. The guys you propose will be out there really are not that great in field either so it's some huge upgrade. Granted Willingham and Parmelee are not great OF but it's not like we'd be replacing them with a GG caliber OF. Certainly Benson, Hicks and Mastroianni are faster and might have better skill but what you give up at the plate isn't worth the extra defense.

#18 MWLFan

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 01:22 PM

Herbek actually jumped from A ball to the majors as did Eisenreich, which is pretty amazing. Gaetti jumped from AA. Viola was drafted in 1981 and made his major league debut within a year. Laudner was draft in 1979 and made his major league debut two years later.

The Griffith regime had a little different philosophy about promoting prospects through the system.



yes Cheaper...hard to believe I know. They also had a good eye for talent and knew what they had in 1980-81 was not what was going to win. But it took a few years to recover from the floatsam that was drifted through in the late 70's early 80's. Patience was required both in the front office and in the fan base. There was no quick easy fix for those problems as there will be none for these current sets.

#19 nicksaviking

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 01:22 PM

When the starting pitching gets lit up, the first thing Gardy is going to do is blame the outfield defense.


Aside from Okie Blackburn, Okie Gardy seems to hold the starters accountable though at times he may lay the excuse on a lingering physical ailment. Last year, I'm pretty sure during every news conference after games that weren't started by Diamond, Gardy used the phrase, "left a few pitches up in the zone" at minimum two times.

#20 nicksaviking

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 01:26 PM

Herbek actually jumped from A ball to the majors as did Eisenreich, which is pretty amazing. Gaetti jumped from AA. Viola was drafted in 1981 and made his major league debut within a year. Laudner was draft in 1979 and made his major league debut two years later.

The Griffith regime had a little different philosophy about promoting prospects through the system.


True and those were exciting times, but we can't pretend that the salary gulf between young players and veterans hasn't exponentially increased over the last 30 years. Young Twins of this era would likely skip a few levels if the Twins weren't most concerned about furture arbitration and losing players to free agency before they hit their prime.

#21 mcrow

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 01:28 PM

Aside from Okie Blackburn, Okie Gardy seems to hold the starters accountable though at times he may lay the excuse on a lingering physical ailment. Last year, I'm pretty sure during every news conference after games that weren't started by Diamond, Gardy used the phrase, "left a few pitches up in the zone" at minimum two times.


Yes, generally he's willing to lay blame where it belongs but like you said it seems like Blackburn was an exception.

#22 mlhouse

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 02:21 PM

Infielders (6): Justin Morneau, Trevor Plouffe, Jamey Carroll, Pedro Florimon, Brian Dozier, Eduardo Escobar

Parmalee, Mauer, and Doumit can all play 1B behind Morneau. Carroll, Esocbar and Dozier can all play utility IF.

Outfielders (4): Josh Willingham, Chris Parmelee, Aaron Hicks, Joe Benson

There is no reason to wait on Aaron Hicks. And, likewise Joe Benson who will be 25 years old before the season starts. Give Benson a shot as the 4th OF at the major league level. If Benson falters, then recall
Mastroianni.

Catchers (2): Joe Mauer, Ryan Doumit

No reason to have Butera on the roster at all. Mauer can get significant rest from catching with Doumit behind the plate either with a scheduled day off or playing 1B. This allows the team to carry an extra IF.

Starting Pitchers (5): Scott Diamond, Kevin Correia, Vance Worley, Mike Pelfrey(IR), Liam Hendriks, Kyle Gibson

Even on an innings restriction Gibson must be in the rotation. When Pelfrey comes back from DL, Hendriks is odd man out.

Relief Pitchers (8): Glen Perkins, Jared Burton, Brian Duensing, Alex Burnett, Casey Fien, Josh Roenicke, Tyler Robertson, Cole DeVries

#23 Rick Blaine

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 03:50 PM

I think Seth's roster projections are probably pretty close. There may be a few cast substitutions among the "subs." They will keep Hicks at Rochester through April. Come June or July we will probably see an outfield of Benson-Hicks-Arcia as Willingham and Morneau are traded at the deadline.

#24 Thrylos

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 05:07 PM

I think that the ST questions as far as the 25-man roster goes, and as far as Ryan & Gardy and Andy go, are for:

2 spots on the IF (Carroll has one locked, which means that Dozier, Florimon, Escobar, or less likely someone else will get them).
1 spot on the OF. Mastro will be up unless he really bombs and Benson and Hicks has a great Spring. These 2 will fight for that one spot.
1 bench spot occupied likely by the IF or the OF (unless his name is Hicks) who loses the above. Colabello might have something different to say about that.


3 rotation spots after Worley and Correia, which will be determined by health. If he can play (word is that he will miss 2 weeks but it is too early,) Diamond has one. Pelfrey is threw 50-60 pitches in a 'pen yesterday, so I think he has another. Gibson? Harden? Hendriks? one of last years' AAAA? Who knows.

All 4 pen spots after Perkins, Burton and Duensing. When healthy Swarzak will have one of them. A whole slew of candidates for those. I think that Swarzak's spot will be taken by one who will lose the last starting spot, unless that is Gibson. Hard to tell who will win the rest.
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#25 jimbo92107

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 07:27 PM

Pitch to contact. If you're going to employ a staff that tries to induce outs via poor contact, then behind the pitcher you're going to need fielders with fast feet, great gloves and strong arms. Given that, it wouldn't surprise me to see both Benson and Hicks start the year in the outfield, with Willingham and Parmelee taking turns at DH.

It also introduces an interesting aspect to the race for third catcher. Chris Hermann can play both C and OF, which makes me wonder how good a hitter he'd have to be to supplant Drew Butera. And if he does, then where does that leave Mastrioanni? With the athletic Joe Benson in the mix, I'm not sure the Twins still need the current 4th outfielder.

It's intriguing how a single factor - Joe Benson's hitting in spring training - could affect the overall makeup of the Twins starting roster.

Edited by jimbo92107, 15 February 2013 - 07:34 PM.


#26 Thrylos

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 08:40 PM

It also introduces an interesting aspect to the race for third catcher. Chris Hermann can play both C and OF, which makes me wonder how good a hitter he'd have to be to supplant Drew Butera. .


This ST, if he hits 1.000, he will not supplant Drew. Next ST, when the people who are running the Twins will, hopefully, be different, things will change.
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#27 stringer bell

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 10:39 AM

The Twins won a lot of game with Delmon and Cuddy on the corner OF posts. I don't think Willingham/Parmelee is much worse in covering ground. However, Delmon/Cuddy was a pair of strong arms that Willingham and Parm will not match.

#28 stringer bell

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 10:45 AM

Of Seth's picks in the bullpen, I think Burnett will end up in Rochester. He has an option left, and while he was okay last year overall, he faded as the season went on and his peripherals weren't very good.

#29 Seth Stohs

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 11:45 AM

Of Seth's picks in the bullpen, I think Burnett will end up in Rochester. He has an option left, and while he was okay last year overall, he faded as the season went on and his peripherals weren't very good.


He doesn't strike many out and for awhile, he had as many walks as strikeouts. But, the last 4-6 weeks, he figured out how to strike guys out. I don't think that they'd send him down, but you make a great point in that he does have an option left whereas Wood, Roenicke, Swarzak and some of the others are out of options and Pressly would have to be offered back. So, that is the one thing that could get Burnett sent down.

#30 LaBombo

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 12:53 PM

Infielders (6): Justin Morneau, Trevor Plouffe, Jamey Carroll, Pedro Florimon, Brian Dozier, Eduardo Escobar

Parmalee, Mauer, and Doumit can all play 1B behind Morneau. Carroll, Esocbar and Dozier can all play utility IF.

Outfielders (4): Josh Willingham, Chris Parmelee, Aaron Hicks, Joe Benson

There is no reason to wait on Aaron Hicks.


Service time and not ready yet, so that's at least two reasons...