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LaVelle: Two Twins Officials Say They Have Offers Out All Over the Place

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#1 East Coast Twin

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 04:02 PM

http://www.startribu.../182245391.html

#2 gunnarthor

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 04:19 PM

Good to know. Hope they can steal Holland.

#3 AllhopeisgoneMNTWINS

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 04:25 PM

I hope they can get Holland, but lets be realistic the Rangers have a good front office and its going to be a hefty price for him. I dont mind getting Saunders or Blanton but as the 3rd option and getting two guys who are better than them...McCarthy or Marcum please.

#4 Rosterman

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 04:31 PM

Hey, the Twins have to do more than just offer, they have to blow guys away. Tell Dempster we give you 3 years for $36 million.Tell McCarthy you take 3 years and $27 million right now, today. The Twins are in a position that if they make an offer, it better be their best, 'cause no one is coming back to them and saying "so-and-so will, how about you going to this." And, I'm sorry, just making an offer doesn't mean that you are playing the game, in the mix of things, being aggressive. I can offer Dempster three years at $5 million per year. But I'm wasting my time and his.
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#5 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 04:34 PM

The Twins are in a position that if they make an offer, it better be their best, 'cause no one is coming back to them and saying "so-and-so will, how about you going to this."


Yes, they will. An agent's job is to get his client (and himself) as much money as possible. You call back all teams that made an offer in an attempt to drive up the price.

#6 mike wants wins

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 05:02 PM

What if they all say yes?.....still hoping.

#7 mike wants wins

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 05:05 PM

Ugh, I just read it....so 4 number 4 or 5 starters....what is the plan? Because those names will not increase, and may decrease, ticket sales.

#8 AllhopeisgoneMNTWINS

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 05:33 PM

Ugh, I just read it....so 4 number 4 or 5 starters....what is the plan? Because those names will not increase, and may decrease, ticket sales.


Your right about that. We need to go after Marcum, McCarthy and maybe Dempster. Twins will probably need to overpay for those guys though as Minnesota is not the hottest destination right now.

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 05:37 PM

Wake me when all these "offers" turn into something that actually improves the Twins in some way.

#10 AllhopeisgoneMNTWINS

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 06:12 PM

Just an FYI Twins are reportedly interested in a recent inductee into the tommy john club Mike Pelfrey....

#11 ashburyjohn

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 06:19 PM

Just an FYI Twins are reportedly interested in a recent inductee into the tommy john club Mike Pelfrey....


Very weird 2012 for Pelfrey - judging by his game log. His third game he went 8 innings, 1ER, against the Giants, going just above 100 pitches so you'd think all was well. Five days later, TJ.

#12 AllhopeisgoneMNTWINS

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 06:42 PM

Just an FYI Twins are reportedly interested in a recent inductee into the tommy john club Mike Pelfrey....


Very weird 2012 for Pelfrey - judging by his game log. His third game he went 8 innings, 1ER, against the Giants, going just above 100 pitches so you'd think all was well. Five days later, TJ.


It is weird, but im not to interested in Pelfrey, I wonder when he would be able to come back this season?

#13 diehardtwinsfan

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 08:06 PM

they couldn't get him in the Santana trade, so they are signing him now?

#14 Jocko87

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:12 PM

I have a very reliable inside source here in Wichita that told me Pelfrey has the Twins at number 1 on his list. Boras and the money are apparently the sticking points but they are pretty deep into negotiations. I'm told the arm feels good and he has his velocity back so who knows, definitely worth kicking the tires if the price is right.

#15 Craig in MN

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:35 PM

I've got as much confidence in Nick Blackburn as I do in Mike Pelfrey. Devries, Pavano or Deduno as well. Pelfrey has had one decent year in the last 4, and was pitching in the NL at that, and no one knows how he'll come back from TJ. I can see the Twins signing him cheap to fight for a rotation spot, but I don't see a point giving him even a guaranteed deal.

#16 AllhopeisgoneMNTWINS

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:39 PM

I've got as much confidence in Nick Blackburn as I do in Mike Pelfrey. Devries, Pavano or Deduno as well. Pelfrey has had one decent year in the last 4, and was pitching in the NL at that, and no one knows how he'll come back from TJ. I can see the Twins signing him cheap to fight for a rotation spot, but I don't see a point giving him even a guaranteed deal.


Maybe a 1 year 2-3 million flyer? I dont know....I have a lot more confidence in him than I do Blacky. For that matter....I have more confidence in any pitcher other than Blackburn.

#17 J-Dog Dungan

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:41 PM

Hey, the Twins have to do more than just offer, they have to blow guys away. Tell Dempster we give you 3 years for $36 million.Tell McCarthy you take 3 years and $27 million right now, today. The Twins are in a position that if they make an offer, it better be their best, 'cause no one is coming back to them and saying "so-and-so will, how about you going to this." And, I'm sorry, just making an offer doesn't mean that you are playing the game, in the mix of things, being aggressive. I can offer Dempster three years at $5 million per year. But I'm wasting my time and his.

When have the Twins done anything to blow FA's away in the way that you are suggesting? Not that I don't think they can't, but it just hasn't happened before. While they do have payroll space, it probably won't mean that we will be spending that much money to splurge on McCarthy or Dempster, especially since Dempster is 35, and only getting older. Not exactly the way the Twins want to go if they are trying to build for the future.

#18 TwinsFanInPhilly

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:52 PM

I have a very reliable inside source here in Wichita that told me Pelfrey has the Twins at number 1 on his list. Boras and the money are apparently the sticking points but they are pretty deep into negotiations. I'm told the arm feels good and he has his velocity back so who knows, definitely worth kicking the tires if the price is right.


I don't want to make it sound like I am questioning you, but I'm trying to figure out what is the Wichita connection, if any?

#19 birdwatcher

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:53 PM

As long as at least one of the FA signees (or additional trade returns) exceeds the "Diamond Standard", who cares how many #5-6 starters they sign to compete with Hendriks, Deduno, Hernandez, Walters, Blackburn, DeVries, Vasquez? The more the merrier.

McCarthy, Marcum, Jackson, Dempster, maybe Saunders match or exceed the Diamond Standard. Let's see how it plays out before we do too much whining about it.

#20 nicksaviking

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:59 PM

I have a very reliable inside source here in Wichita that told me Pelfrey has the Twins at number 1 on his list. Boras and the money are apparently the sticking points but they are pretty deep into negotiations. I'm told the arm feels good and he has his velocity back so who knows, definitely worth kicking the tires if the price is right.


I don't want to make it sound like I am questioning you, but I'm trying to figure out what is the Wichita connection, if any?


Looks like Pelfrey's from Witchita.

I'd imagine a lot of pitchers looking for a rebuond year would have the Twins high on the list seeing as there is plenty of rotation space to be had and there'd be less worry of ending up in the pen or DFA'd.

#21 Jocko87

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 05:24 PM

I have a very reliable inside source here in Wichita that told me Pelfrey has the Twins at number 1 on his list. Boras and the money are apparently the sticking points but they are pretty deep into negotiations. I'm told the arm feels good and he has his velocity back so who knows, definitely worth kicking the tires if the price is right.


I don't want to make it sound like I am questioning you, but I'm trying to figure out what is the Wichita connection, if any?


Yeah, high school and college at Wichita State. I live half a block from the park and work with a very very close family friend. I didn't press to much about the velocity thing, whether it just feels zippy or on the gun. I can ask more later. I don't want to speak out of turn but I believe that he has some non-baseball reasons to want to be in Minnesota as well so that plus a pretty damn good chance to make the rotation would make sense. If he wants to be there it should help with the Boras effect. I'd take him in a heartbeat if the money makes sense.

#22 SpiritofVodkaDave

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 06:18 PM

Pelfrey is an interesting case, if you can get him at 1-2 million or so, he could provide you 190-200 IP at the back end of the rotation. It's weird because he has always underpreformed, maybe a change of scenary (out of a miserable NY Mets org) could be just what he needs to turn it around a bit.

I would be thrilled if he could give the Twins about 200 IP and a 4.15-4.30 ERA in the 5 spot. (It certainly beats giving someone a higher contract for the same basic potential performance.

With Pelfrey and Worley the Twins could basically lock up 2/5ths of the rotation more or less on the cheap. That would allow them to potentially hand out 2 10+ mil contracts for the #1 and #2 spots.

#23 darin617

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 07:38 PM

I have a very reliable inside source here in Wichita that told me Pelfrey has the Twins at number 1 on his list. Boras and the money are apparently the sticking points but they are pretty deep into negotiations. I'm told the arm feels good and he has his velocity back so who knows, definitely worth kicking the tires if the price is right.


Was your very reliable source non other than the great
[h=1]thrylos98?[/h]

#24 Riverbrian

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:04 PM

[quote name='Jocko87'][quote name='TwinsFanInPhilly'][quote name='Jocko87']I have a very reliable inside source here in Wichita that told me Pelfrey has the Twins at number 1 on his list. Boras and the money are apparently the sticking points but they are pretty deep into negotiations. I'm told the arm feels good and he has his velocity back so who knows, definitely worth kicking the tires if the price is right.[/QUOTE]

I don't want to make it sound like I am questioning you, but I'm trying to figure out what is the Wichita connection, if any?[/QUOTE]

Yeah, high school and college at Wichita State. I live half a block from the park and work with a very very close family friend. I didn't press to much about the velocity thing, whether it just feels zippy or on the gun. I can ask more later. I don't want to speak out of turn but I believe that he has some non-baseball reasons to want to be in Minnesota as well so that plus a pretty damn good chance to make the rotation would make sense. If he wants to be there it should help with the Boras effect. I'd take him in a heartbeat if the money makes sense.[/QUOTE]

I'll take your word on it... If So... I hope it happens because Pelfrey is one of the guys I'd like to see in a Twins uniform.

#25 YourHouseIsMyHouse

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 10:01 PM

I'll take your word on it... If So... I hope it happens because Pelfrey is one of the guys I'd like to see in a Twins uniform.


I really don't understand your affection for junky contact pitchers. Pelfrey, Lannan, Nick Blackburn circa 2012, and Jason Marquis are all extremely similar numbers wise. High WHIP, Bad SO/BB, and 4's ERA. They're all #5s at best when they luck out and when they don't you'll be screaming at the TV.

Are those guys all bad? I guess not, but they aren't good by any means.They were non-tendered for a reason, however, and that's because they aren't even worth 4+ million. Pitching is the last area that a FO should ever cut corners on budget wise. Right now, Minnesota has plenty of money to sign two very good pitchers. The Twins need front line, good starting pitchers. Signing those first two would be more of the same. If Pelfrey pitches for us next season I will feel lowballed and backstabbed by the Pohlads.

#26 spycake

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 10:04 PM

The Twins are in a position that if they make an offer, it better be their best, 'cause no one is coming back to them and saying "so-and-so will, how about you going to this."


Yes, they will. An agent's job is to get his client (and himself) as much money as possible. You call back all teams that made an offer in an attempt to drive up the price.

I find this to be an interesting point of discussion. What process actually leads to the most money possible? I think keeping teams in the dark might be the best strategy -- that way, the player/agent are the only ones who know the true market, and the teams have to guess at market and might overshoot it. Basically, unless the player/agent has a special relationship with a team/GM, you let them bid blindly the whole time. That means simply disregarding any low-ball offers -- it's almost certainly a waste of time to negotiate with those clubs. You may only come back to a club if you're at a decision point and you have two or more similarly competitive offers (if you come back to a club at all -- optimal strategy may be never).

Given this, I am guessing the Twins do not make many offers ever, and probably almost zero offers to anything above bargain-basement free agents. All indications are that they know the free-agent game but choose not to play it.

If anyone has any information otherwise though, I'm all ears. It's a fascinating process, I'm sure.

#27 Riverbrian

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 10:24 PM


I'll take your word on it... If So... I hope it happens because Pelfrey is one of the guys I'd like to see in a Twins uniform.


I really don't understand your affection for junky contact pitchers. Pelfrey, Lannan, Nick Blackburn circa 2012, and Jason Marquis are all extremely similar numbers wise. High WHIP, Bad SO/BB, and 4's ERA. They're all #5s at best when they luck out and when they don't you'll be screaming at the TV.

Are those guys all bad? I guess not, but they aren't good by any means.They were non-tendered for a reason, however, and that's because they aren't even worth 4+ million. Pitching is the last area that a FO should ever cut corners on budget wise. Right now, Minnesota has plenty of money to sign two very good pitchers. The Twins need front line, good starting pitchers. Signing those first two would be more of the same. If Pelfrey pitches for us next season I will feel lowballed and backstabbed by the Pohlads.


Thats ok... Cuz I don't understand it either...

I guess it comes down to my expectations and trying to keep them reasonable right now... If it was my money... I'd target the guy I liked best and spent unreasonably to get him. Someone under 30 and for at leadt 3 years... Jackson or Sanchez I guess.... Because Greinke would have blown the whole budget. After Jackson or Sanchez... We still need more and that is where... Pelfrey comes in... Along with Marcum and Villanueva...

Pelfrey has been inconsistent but he's had some decent years and we need arms. We gotta roll the dice on someone.

As for Lannan... He isn't on my list... It just seems like he is on Terry Ryan's list... Therefore Im curious why they didn't just include him in the Span trade.

Edited by Riverbrian, 07 December 2012 - 10:26 PM.


#28 SpiritofVodkaDave

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Posted 08 December 2012 - 12:37 AM

The reason I prefer Pelfrey over a guy like Marquis/Blackburn/Lannan is because I still remember a few years ago when he was a top 30 prospect....i know...i know... It's a really dumb reason to hang onto, but the idea that there is still maybe a shred of upside there intrigues me to signing him to a 1 year/2 mil contract over a a guy like Marquis and Lannan.

#29 Shane Wahl

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Posted 08 December 2012 - 12:42 AM

Pelfrey is bad, but not as bad as Lannan. That is pretty clear. He just looks like a mess out there with a career 1.59 K/BB rate. Good god.

#30 Riverbrian

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Posted 08 December 2012 - 12:46 AM

The pile to pick from is getting kinda... (Put your adjective here).