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Game 55--Twins v. Royals 6/5/2012

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#1 J-Dog Dungan

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 04:47 PM

Royals SP: Bruce Chen-Last 10 years v. Twins: 2-5, 5.46 ERA. Twins Lineup: 1. Denard Span CF 2. Darin Mastroianni RF 3. Josh Willingham LF 4. Justin Morneau 1B 5. Ryan Doumit DH 6. Trever Plouffe 3B 7. Brian Dozier SS 8. Drew Butera C 9. Jamey Carroll 2B Twins SP: Francisco Liriano; 1-5, 7.20 ERA, 1.88 WHIP, 39 K; Against the Royals in his career: 6-4, 4.26 ERA, 51 K

#2 jeffk

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 05:06 PM

I don't see what's the point of playing Darin Mastroianni when you can just play Ben Revere. He's playing well but has not played so many games in a row that he should need a rest. Here's a chance to see if it's for real.

#3 IdahoPilgrim

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 05:10 PM

I don't see what's the point of playing Darin Mastroianni when you can just play Ben Revere. He's playing well but has not played so many games in a row that he should need a rest. Here's a chance to see if it's for real.


Gardy likes to make sure everybody gets some playing time, and Mastoianni hasn't played much recently. You have to give people a few swings every few days just to have them keep their timing. Personally, I would send him back down to AAA for more regular playing time, but I'm not sure who I would bring up to replace him.

#4 J-Dog Dungan

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 05:15 PM

Twins are probably thinking that if Mastroianni isn't doing well against ML fastballs, they might as well put him in against a guy who has an average high school (varsity high school) fastball around 86-88. Incredible that people haven't knocked him out of the league because of how slow he throws. i hope the Twins repeat (or close to repeat) their performance against this guy from earlier in the year.

#5 Shane Wahl

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 05:25 PM

Chen is a lefty.

#6 ashburyjohn

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 05:31 PM

but I'm not sure who I would bring up to replace him.


Clete. Clete. Clete.

#7 twinsnorth49

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 05:34 PM

Twins are probably thinking that if Mastroianni isn't doing well against ML fastballs, they might as well put him in against a guy who has an average high school (varsity high school) fastball around 86-88. Incredible that people haven't knocked him out of the league because of how slow he throws. i hope the Twins repeat (or close to repeat) their performance against this guy from earlier in the year.


Kind of blows a hole in the argument that you need to throw 90mph to stick in this league for awhile. Changing speeds and lots of movement can keep you around.

#8 J-Dog Dungan

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 05:36 PM

Kind of blows a hole in the argument that you need to throw 90mph to stick in this league for awhile. Changing speeds and lots of movement can keep you around.


Fair enough. For people who have been complaining about Pavano, this is pretty much how he has survived as well.

#9 twinsnorth49

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 05:46 PM

Seeing as Frankie is starting again, I just wanted to point out to those who wrote off his performance as hollow because it came against a poor hitting team in the A's, that the same A's team ripped Texas for 15 hits and 12 runs last night. The fact they didn't do that to Liriano says something about how well he pitched and how well an MLB team can hit if a pitcher is not performing.

#10 twinsnorth49

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 05:48 PM

Fair enough. For people who have been complaining about Pavano, this is pretty much how he has survived as well.


That's why I see some hope for Diamond and to a lesser extent Walters and both of them have a better fastball than Pavano and guys like Chen.

#11 IdahoPilgrim

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 05:50 PM

the same A's team ripped Texas for 15 hits and 12 runs last night.


Even the blind squirrel finds an acorn once in a while.

#12 twinsnorth49

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:05 PM

Even the blind squirrel finds an acorn once in a while.


Good analysis, lots of facts.

#13 woolhouse

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:15 PM

Well, Chen just struck out Span and Mastroianni... so, he's doing something right.

#14 IdahoPilgrim

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:17 PM

Good analysis, lots of facts.


Thank you.

#15 NorthwestTwinsFan

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:20 PM

I see Liriano is sticking with his strategy of walking the leadoff hitter. Let's see if it works out for him.

#16 IdahoPilgrim

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:21 PM

Good analysis, lots of facts.


Oakland - last in the AL in team batting average, on-base percentage, slugging percentage, and OPS.

#17 twinsnorth49

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:27 PM

Oakland - last in the AL in team batting average, on-base percentage, slugging percentage, and OPS.


You're right, they sure showed that last night. The point is poor pitching nets the results from last night, good pitching nets results like they had against Liriano.

#18 twinsnorth49

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:28 PM

Way to come out of that Frankie, more than one way to skin a cat (not endorsing that for the politically correct crowd).

#19 twinsnorth49

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:33 PM

Too easy fellas, to eager to swing at junk, make him work.

#20 ltwedt

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:33 PM

Please tell me how playing Mast... Makes ANY sense at all. Revere has been playing well - is this just Gardy being Gardy?

#21 ashburyjohn

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:41 PM

more than one way to skin a cat (not endorsing that for the politically correct crowd).


How do you feel about straw men instead?

#22 NorthwestTwinsFan

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:47 PM

What the hell was that, Butera?

#23 IdahoPilgrim

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:49 PM

You're right, they sure showed that last night. The point is poor pitching nets the results from last night, good pitching nets results like they had against Liriano.


**sigh** Just because they had a good night does not mean they are a good hitting team; they just had a good or lucky day. When a blind squirrel finds an acorn, it doesn't mean the squirrel is no longer blind; it just had a good or lucky day. Hence the analogy.

And the thesis others are making is that Frankie's numbers last outing might not have looked so good if he had faced a team that consistently hits better - such as Texas. Some of the pitches that got by Oakland hitters for strikes might have been put into play by a stronger lineup. We know from bitter experience earlier this season that sometimes anemic hitting can make even questionable pitching look good. That's why some of us are waiting to see if the results are reproduceable before we proclaim that Liriano is back.

#24 NorthwestTwinsFan

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:53 PM

Bruce Chen's pickoff move is about as close as a pitcher can get to balking, without actually balking. Some of those are pretty borderline.

#25 twinsnorth49

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 07:04 PM

**sigh** Just because they had a good night does not mean they are a good hitting team; they just had a good or lucky day. When a blind squirrel finds an acorn, it doesn't mean the squirrel is no longer blind; it just had a good or lucky day. Hence the analogy.

And the thesis others are making is that Frankie's numbers last outing might not have looked so good if he had faced a team that consistently hits better - such as Texas. Some of the pitches that got by Oakland hitters for strikes might have been put into play by a stronger lineup. We know from bitter experience earlier this season that sometimes anemic hitting can make even questionable pitching look good. That's why some of us are waiting to see if the results are reproduceable before we proclaim that Liriano is back.



Sigh, he had a good game, stop the over analysis, that's all it is.

#26 NorthwestTwinsFan

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 07:08 PM

Judging by this game, Bruce Chen is a dominating, Cy Young Award candidate.

#27 twinsnorth49

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 07:13 PM

That is good pitching.

#28 deanlambrecht

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 07:42 PM

Here's some actual analysis about Liriano's last start, and what made it particularly good: http://www.fangraphs...the-zone-again/

#29 mike wants wins

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 07:48 PM

But if the game ended tonight, he'd get a loss. Such a stupid stat....glad to see him pitching well again. I don't care who it is against, it's good to see him pitch well.
Lighten up Francis....

#30 twinsnorth49

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Posted 05 June 2012 - 07:50 PM

Here's some actual analysis about Liriano's last start, and what made it particularly good: http://www.fangraphs...the-zone-again/


Great stuff and anyone who actually saw the game would come to the same conclusion. I wonder what the issue will be tonight from the glass half empty crowd.