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  • What in the Hell is a Pedro Florimon?

    "What in the hell is a Pedro Florimon?" -- professional baseball writer, doing research on projected starting lineups

    — Grant Brisbee (@mccoveychron) January 25, 2013

    The above tweet from the wise-cracking and hilarious SB Nation scribe Grant Brisbee was undoubtedly written after he glanced over projected starting lineups across the majors and did a triple-take when he came to Minnesota's shortstop position.

    He's hardly the first. I've had multiple national baseball writers contact me this offseason asking some variation of, "The Twins aren't really going to give this guy a starting job, are they?"

    All I can do is shrug. Florimon's career numbers suggest he is not a major-league caliber player, and he certainly didn't look the part last year, but Terry Ryan has treated shortstop as a non-concern this winter. Possibly the GM is open to trying Brian Dozier there again, or considers Jamey Carroll an acceptable fallback, but Ryan hasn't even openly pondered bringing in someone to compete at the position. He's repeatedly talked about doing so with Trevor Plouffe at third.

    It's not clear what Florimon has done to earn this billing. He was waived by a 93-loss Orioles team after the 2011 season, and then passed on by 29 organizations when the Twins claimed him and outrighted him from their 40-man roster. He went on to up sub par numbers between Double-A and Triple-A, striking out at a Gomez-esque 25 percent rate, and then came up and played poorly with the Twins for a couple months.

    Pedro Florimon swings for the Minnesota Twins

    At TwinsFest over the weekend, Ryan told a media luncheon that Florimon is "the athlete you look for" at shortstop. That may very well be true, and ostensibly the hope is that he'll develop as he ages into his prime and become a useful long-term cog on this rebuilding roster.

    But with Florimon, that really is a stretch. He's 26 and he's totaled over 3,000 professional plate appearances. He has established himself very firmly at the plate as a strikeout machine with minimal power and in the field as a flashy, skillful defender who makes a ton of mistakes.

    In order to provide meaningful value, he'll need to offer enough on defense to make up for all the outs he's likely to give away on offense. That's a tall order. He might be the biggest long shot the Twins have taken at the position since Cristian Guzman's departure, and that's saying something.
    This article was originally published in blog: What in the Hell is a Pedro Florimon? started by Nick Nelson
    Comments 101 Comments
    1. Chance's Avatar
      Chance -
      The problem is most note that Dozier would be the starting SS if Florimon can't hold it down. I believe in Dozier as a serviceable major leaguer but feel he is better off at 2B where we also don't have a starter. I can't believe competion for Plouffe was a bigger priority than a middle infielder.

      what if Carroll and Florimon or dozier get hurt? You have Escobar and what?
    1. Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
      Brock Beauchamp -
      Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
      Anybody can see he's no offensive threat. But that is not why you have shortstops.
      Alex Rodriguez, Cal Ripken, Derek Jeter, Nomar Garciaparra, Hanley Ramirez, Elvis Andrus, Jose Reyes, Troy Tulowitzki, et al disagree.

      This is not 1986, people. The shortstop position has changed and it's time for Ryan to acknowledge that fundamental shift in the way baseball is played in 2013. The Twins shouldn't try to roll out Greg Gagne simply because it worked in 1987.
    1. Boom Boom's Avatar
      Boom Boom -
      Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
      Ah, the old "if everyone else does their job, he doesn't have to hit" gem. Thanks for that, cmat, it's been too long since someone trotted that out. Well played.
      I remember all the same things said about Nick Punto... who is a vastly superior player to Florimon.
    1. ThePuck's Avatar
      ThePuck -
      Quote Originally Posted by Boom Boom View Post
      I remember all the same things said about Nick Punto... who is a vastly superior player to Florimon.
      Wow, how bad does someone have top be where PUNTO is a vastly superior player...
    1. nokomismod's Avatar
      nokomismod -
      Quote Originally Posted by old nurse View Post
      Could it be that what was available on the free agent market was not much better than Floriman so there was no need to discuss bringing in competition?
      I think this is the reason. Ryan isn't feeling the expectation to win this year. He still has Carrol signed for around $3million and if either Florimon, Dozier, or the other guy can't nail down SS, Carrol will play the majority and they will look to improve the position next offseason when there is more of an expectation to win and maybe better free agents.
    1. Bombo Rivera's Avatar
      Bombo Rivera -
      Whoever the Twins plug in at these positions will be out-making-machines. Unfortunately I mean with the bat....not with the glove. Can we DH for either of these positions?
    1. nicksaviking's Avatar
      nicksaviking -
      Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
      Ah, the old "if everyone else does their job, he doesn't have to hit" gem. Thanks for that, cmat, it's been too long since someone trotted that out. Well played.
      Yeah, I know the guys around my office who don't pull their weight are really popular.

      Hope no one was hoping for Kelly Johnson to make the decision easier for the middle infield. He signed with those free spending Rays.
    1. Nick Nelson's Avatar
      Nick Nelson -
      Quote Originally Posted by cmathewson View Post
      Anybody can see he's no offensive threat. But that is not why you have shortstops.
      Everyone understands that SS is a defensive position and the offensive expectations there are lower. That's why the average production there is lower than most others. But Florimon (like most guys the Twins have trotted out there over the past decade) is well below even that reduced average. Is it that much to ask for a guy who can play defense and at least has a chance to be average with the stick?
    1. ALessKosherScott's Avatar
      ALessKosherScott -
      Aaah, Xerox Houston Jimenez. You're just a copy of every other Houston Jimenez I've ever booed.
    1. Badsmerf's Avatar
      Badsmerf -
      Another example of JR's inability to run a successful ML team. His moves this offseason look good for the minor league system, but have once again left the ML club bent over with a strap on aimed at them.
    1. mike wants wins's Avatar
      mike wants wins -
      He just did not have the resources to fix all the problems this off-season, so he fixed the pitching this year....next year he will fix the infield....
    1. twinsnorth49's Avatar
      twinsnorth49 -
      Quote Originally Posted by mike wants wins View Post
      He just did not have the resources to fix all the problems this off-season, so he fixed the pitching this year....next year he will fix the infield....
      You're kidding right?...I mean tell me you are...please.
    1. greengoblinrulz's Avatar
      greengoblinrulz -
      Everyone freaked on Dozier's age but Pedro is older than Bryan.
      Part of the reason they are a 90 loss team
    1. jokin's Avatar
      jokin -
      Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
      Alex Rodriguez, Cal Ripken, Derek Jeter, Nomar Garciaparra, Hanley Ramirez, Elvis Andrus, Jose Reyes, Troy Tulowitzki, et al disagree.

      This is not 1986, people. The shortstop position has changed and it's time for Ryan to acknowledge that fundamental shift in the way baseball is played in 2013. The Twins shouldn't try to roll out Greg Gagne simply because it worked in 1987.
      But.... then we couldn't eagerly and expectantly ponder the Cmathweson notion of "the Promise of Florimon"!

      From what we saw last season, plus his minor league comps, hardly makes me think he is even up to the 1987 version of a SS in Twinsland.

      Florimon minor league slash: .249/.321/.354/.675

      Gagne's minor league slash: .259/.333/.406/.739
    1. jokin's Avatar
      jokin -
      Quote Originally Posted by greengoblinrulz View Post
      Everyone freaked on Dozier's age but Pedro is older than Bryan.
      Part of the reason they are a 90 loss team
      Temper your enthusiasm, green...
    1. jokin's Avatar
      jokin -
      Quote Originally Posted by nicksaviking View Post
      Yeah, I know the guys around my office who don't pull their weight are really popular.

      Hope no one was hoping for Kelly Johnson to make the decision easier for the middle infield. He signed with those free spending Rays.
      I saw that and I feel now that Ryan and Pohlad were just mocking the fans at their weekend media appearances.
    1. jokin's Avatar
      jokin -
      Quote Originally Posted by Bombo Rivera View Post
      Whoever the Twins plug in at these positions will be out-making-machines. Unfortunately I mean with the bat....not with the glove. Can we DH for either of these positions?
      Sign Dontrelle Willis and Carlos Zambrano, then it would be a no-brainer.
    1. jokin's Avatar
      jokin -
      Quote Originally Posted by nokomismod View Post
      I think this is the reason. Ryan isn't feeling the expectation to win this year. He still has Carrol signed for around $3million and if either Florimon, Dozier, or the other guy can't nail down SS, Carrol will play the majority and they will look to improve the position next offseason when there is more of an expectation to win and maybe better free agents.
      Why, 2 years of ineptitude wasn't enough?

      Don't let Ryan off this easy, there were more than enough options available for upgrade, either by FA or trade.
    1. drjim's Avatar
      drjim -
      People realize SS is a pretty difficult position to fill right? There aren't clearly better players sitting on the free agent market or on waivers or any other means that have been mentioned in this thread.

      I imagine Terry Ryan would gladly welcome a better SS but it is a little more complicated than saying "let's get a better shortstop."
    1. drjim's Avatar
      drjim -
      Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
      Alex Rodriguez, Cal Ripken, Derek Jeter, Nomar Garciaparra, Hanley Ramirez, Elvis Andrus, Jose Reyes, Troy Tulowitzki, et al disagree.

      This is not 1986, people. The shortstop position has changed and it's time for Ryan to acknowledge that fundamental shift in the way baseball is played in 2013. The Twins shouldn't try to roll out Greg Gagne simply because it worked in 1987.
      It's also not 2003to anymore. There is a serious shortage of high quality SSs in baseball right now. I appreciate you mentioning several hall of famers but those are relatively rare and hard to acquire.
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