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View Full Version : Video challenges come to MLB



IdahoPilgrim
08-15-2013, 01:40 PM
According to the article, starting next year managers will have a challenge system for video replay similar to what the NFL does. Note particularly that, on disputed plays, the final call will be made be an official in the league offices and not the crew on the field, similar to what the NHL does right now.

The only thing off-limits is balls & strikes.

MLB expands instant replay in 2014 to include manager video challenges - ESPN (http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/9570618/mlb-expands-instant-replay-2014-include-manager-video-challenges)

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/2013/08/15/mlb-instant-replay-manager-challenges-on-hold/2659555/

Personally, I think eventually balls & strikes too will be subject to more electronic scrutiny. Welcome to the 21st century, MLB.

TheLeviathan
08-15-2013, 01:52 PM
Oof, if this slows baseball down as much as it has football....this could get ugly fast.

I hope they've really planned for that - the NHL is VERY quick most of the time, let's hope it follows that model.

IdahoPilgrim
08-15-2013, 02:09 PM
Oof, if this slows baseball down as much as it has football....this could get ugly fast.

I hope they've really planned for that - the NHL is VERY quick most of the time, let's hope it follows that model.

I concur. Hopefully with the way it is structured, with only 1 challenge each in the first 6 innings, games that are blowouts or not close will not have all 3 used per team. I also like having a trained crew in New York, presumably with rule book in hand, to handle disputed calls. Sometimes umpires on the field do misremember a rule and make a mistake. Doesn't happen often, but...

James
08-15-2013, 02:34 PM
How are managers supposed to get thrown out of the game now if they can just challenge the play?

IdahoPilgrim
08-15-2013, 02:44 PM
How are managers supposed to get thrown out of the game now if they can just challenge the play?

I'm guessing that Gardy's wife is doing cartwheels right about now.

drjim
08-15-2013, 03:31 PM
Challenges are a terrible idea. I would just use a buzz system. There are missed calls but it is much fewer than people think, maybe one a game average.

IdahoPilgrim
08-15-2013, 03:34 PM
One thing it may do is cut down the acting by managers - sometimes they come out to argue, not because they actually think the call was wrong, but for tactical reasons, to break up some momentum or to support a player or to influence a future call, etc.

USAFChief
08-15-2013, 06:10 PM
Good lord, leave it to baseball to finally accept replay, but then muck up the implementation horribly.

Just have a 5th ump in a booth watching the game in real time. In 99% of the cases, we know via replay at home whether or not a call was blown before the ball is put in play again. When a call is blow, he lets the head ump know and the whole thing is fixed in a few seconds.

A challange system is just stupid.

twinsnorth49
08-15-2013, 06:42 PM
Good lord, leave it to baseball to finally accept replay, but then muck up the implementation horribly.

Just have a 5th ump in a booth watching the game in real time. In 99% of the cases, we know via replay at home whether or not a call was blown before the ball is put in play again. When a call is blow, he lets the head ump know and the whole thing is fixed in a few seconds.

A challange system is just stupid.

I agree in principle with that Chief, but somebody has to call for a review on any given play, it can't be the guy in the booth or else every play is subject to his discretion, that can't work.

USAFChief
08-15-2013, 07:13 PM
I agree in principle with that Chief, but somebody has to call for a review on any given play, it can't be the guy in the booth or else every play is subject to his discretion, that can't work.
I don't see why not. Like I said, we usually know if there's a blown call before the ball is ever put back into play. I doubt there'd be much disruption as 99% of the time the umps get it correct. IMO a 5th ump would be in the background and pretty invisible.

having managers challenge is going to muck up the flow, lead to second guessing, and inevitably end up with a call badly blown that alters a game but goes uncorrected because a manager is out of challenges or learns of the blown call too late.

does ANYone think the NFL gets replay correct?

notoriousgod71
08-15-2013, 07:53 PM
I can't wait until someone challenges but is not allowed to on a technicality like Schwartz on Thanksgiving.

snepp
08-15-2013, 08:00 PM
Everything Chief said, I'm in full concurment.



And yes, that is a word, urban dictionary says so.

USAFChief
08-15-2013, 10:02 PM
And yes, that is a word, urban dictionary says so. Concur.

notoriousgod71
08-15-2013, 10:29 PM
They should also have a challenge system for when their players screw up.

twinsnorth49
08-15-2013, 11:19 PM
I don't see why not. Like I said, we usually know if there's a blown call before the ball is ever put back into play. I doubt there'd be much disruption as 99% of the time the umps get it correct. IMO a 5th ump would be in the background and pretty invisible.

having managers challenge is going to muck up the flow, lead to second guessing, and inevitably end up with a call badly blown that alters a game but goes uncorrected because a manager is out of challenges or learns of the blown call too late.

does ANYone think the NFL gets replay correct?

Like I said, I agree with you, the manager challenge is a poor idea and lord knows the NFL is a shining exaple of that. I'm just talking about implementation of the 5th ump and how and when a call is determined to be blown, essentially what you're saying is that the 5th ump calls the entire game.

I'm really just talking logistics, I suppose it could work, the communication would have to be pretty seamless though.

USAFChief
08-16-2013, 08:53 AM
Like I said, I agree with you, the manager challenge is a poor idea and lord knows the NFL is a shining exaple of that. I'm just talking about implementation of the 5th ump and how and when a call is determined to be blown, essentially what you're saying is that the 5th ump calls the entire game.

I'm really just talking logistics, I suppose it could work, the communication would have to be pretty seamless though.
You are correct, as usual. There would be issues. IMO those issues could be worked out, just like the issues they'll have with a challenge system. They'll need the same amount of video capabilities for the challenge system, for example.

drjim
08-16-2013, 09:39 AM
I want replay but the more I think about it the more I wish they had done nothing instead of a challenge system.

jorgenswest
08-17-2013, 05:43 PM
The real discussion should be about how a team can gain an advantage by utilizing the rules well. I would like to hear the Twins responses to these questions.

Are the Twins preparing now? Are they simulating when they might use it during a game? Are they practicing the communication and decision making process?

Every event in baseball has a run value. Will the bench know the value of reversing the event? Will they use the general table or a custom one that varies with the specific pitcher, batter and game condition? Some events may be easier to see in replay than others and therefore more likely to be reversed. Are the Twins studying this by looking at old video and multiple cameras?

I hope the Twins have someone working and preparing the analytics and decision making process. Some teams are going to find a way to get advantage a squeeze out a win or two. I am guessing the Rays and Joe Maddon will be preparing. Other teams will not be as prepared. Their decision making process may be reactionary and more dependent on the emotion of the moment. Those teams might find it costs them a win or two.

IdahoPilgrim
08-17-2013, 05:56 PM
The real discussion should be about how a team can gain an advantage by utilizing the rules well. I would like to hear the Twins responses to these questions.

Are the Twins preparing now? Are they simulating when they might use it during a game? Are they practicing the communication and decision making process?

Every event in baseball has a run value. Will the bench know the value of reversing the event? Will they use the general table or a custom one that varies with the specific pitcher, batter and game condition? Some events may be easier to see in replay than others and therefore more likely to be reversed. Are the Twins studying this by looking at old video and multiple cameras?

I hope the Twins have someone working and preparing the analytics and decision making process. Some teams are going to find a way to get advantage a squeeze out a win or two. I am guessing the Rays and Joe Maddon will be preparing. Other teams will not be as prepared. Their decision making process may be reactionary and more dependent on the emotion of the moment. Those teams might find it costs them a win or two.

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSirmEMCIDWN91SZqew7NsAKEhLqf6pO PBD9S0LcQvyooY5FtRXcw

I think they've hired an intern for this.

USAFChief
08-17-2013, 08:13 PM
The real discussion should be about how a team can gain an advantage by utilizing the rules well.

I thought the real discussion was about getting more calls correct.

Silly me.

snepp
08-17-2013, 08:23 PM
I thought the real discussion was about getting more calls correct.


Not about placating Interweb loudmouths?

jorgenswest
08-17-2013, 08:32 PM
I thought the real discussion was about getting more calls correct.

Silly me.

A discussion killer. No matter. The Twins probably aren't discussing it either.

jctwins
08-23-2013, 10:07 AM
I'm late to this thread, but agree with Chief's suggestion, and thought the same thing before I read it here. The only other thing I think would be great would be a green light/red light signal in centerfield. Maybe even a yellow when calls are under review. If there is a close play, let the 5th umpire turn on the green light to confirm the call. It engages the fans and gives them the feedback we've all wanted but haven't gotten with replays not being shown in the park.

Yellow light if under review, red light if the call is wrong.

If no light, it's up to the home plate umpire, batter, and catcher to keep the game moving or suffer a slow play penalty under the current rules. A green light should mitigage that, though.

jay
08-23-2013, 12:52 PM
The real discussion should be about how a team can gain an advantage by utilizing the rules well. I would like to hear the Twins responses to these questions.

Are the Twins preparing now? Are they simulating when they might use it during a game? Are they practicing the communication and decision making process?

Every event in baseball has a run value. Will the bench know the value of reversing the event? Will they use the general table or a custom one that varies with the specific pitcher, batter and game condition? Some events may be easier to see in replay than others and therefore more likely to be reversed. Are the Twins studying this by looking at old video and multiple cameras?

I hope the Twins have someone working and preparing the analytics and decision making process. Some teams are going to find a way to get advantage a squeeze out a win or two. I am guessing the Rays and Joe Maddon will be preparing. Other teams will not be as prepared. Their decision making process may be reactionary and more dependent on the emotion of the moment. Those teams might find it costs them a win or two.

Beautifully said. I'd hope for the same things, but unfortunately, I believe many of us think the Twins will end up in that latter camp.