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John Bonnes
07-26-2013, 02:00 PM
In his latest MLB Trade Deadline update, ESPN's Jayson Stark gives us this nugget:


The Pirates might not be as focused on Alex Rios (http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/_/id/5880/alex-rios) in their big-bat shopping spree as they've been portrayed. For one thing, Rios' contract -- which would increase his base pay to $13 million next season if he's traded -- doesn't fit into their projected payroll. And other scouts say Pirates scouts have grumbled that Rios doesn't always play hard.


Here's a name to file away: Justin Morneau (http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/_/id/5379/justin-morneau). Even though the Pirates would prefer a right-handed bat who could play right field, they could slide Garrett Jones (http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/_/id/28763/garrett-jones) back to right (where he's played 265 games) if they deal for a first baseman. And we've heard they've inquired with the Twins about Morneau.



This makes a lot of sense to me. And the fiscally strapped Pirates could have the Twins pick up some of that salary and throw back a better prospect.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/page/rumblings130726/calling-stiffer-ped-penalties-mlb

PseudoSABR
07-26-2013, 02:11 PM
Allen Hanson here we come. #wishfulthinking

cmb0252
07-26-2013, 02:12 PM
Morny won't demand a high level return but the Pirates might be the perfect trade partner. Last year at the trade deadline the Pirates traded their competitive balance pick to the Marlins for Gaby Sanchez. This year the Pirates were awarded the 5th comp B pick, between rounds 2 and 3, which should be worth about ~800K next year. If we could get an extra draft pick, heck the extra money is worth it by itself, and maybe a lottery ticket for a few months of Morny I would be happy. Also, the front office has no excuses to why it can't pay part, if not all, of his salary.

mike wants wins
07-26-2013, 02:22 PM
Pay all of the salary, it is a sunk cost. There is no reason other than cheapness not to pay the full salary. Get more prospects, it is clear that is the only way games are meaningful here again, in the future.

Boom Boom
07-26-2013, 02:28 PM
I'm all for it, whatever the Bucs can offer.

I don't think the Twins really want to trade Morneau, however. We've seen how loyal they are to "their (Gardy's) guys". I'm still amazed that the Twins ever let Cuddyer and Punto go.

edavis0308
07-26-2013, 02:39 PM
I'm all for it, whatever the Bucs can offer.

I don't think the Twins really want to trade Morneau, however. We've seen how loyal they are to "their (Gardy's) guys". I'm still amazed that the Twins ever let Cuddyer and Punto go.

That is where you are at the intersection of 'loyalty' and 'pay people'.

jorgenswest
07-26-2013, 02:39 PM
Morny won't demand a high level return but the Pirates might be the perfect trade partner. Last year at the trade deadline the Pirates traded their competitive balance pick to the Marlins for Gaby Sanchez. This year the Pirates were awarded the 5th comp B pick, between rounds 2 and 3, which should be worth about ~800K next year. If we could get an extra draft pick, heck the extra money is worth it by itself, and maybe a lottery ticket for a few months of Morny I would be happy. Also, the front office has no excuses to why it can't pay part, if not all, of his salary.

A good idea. It gives the Twins the value of making a qualifying offer without risking he will take it.

jay
07-26-2013, 02:57 PM
A good idea. It gives the Twins the value of making a qualifying offer without risking he will take it.

While the difference between a comp pick after round 1 and the comp B pick the Pirates have after round 2 isn't quite insignificant, that's an excellent way to view it.

cmb0252
07-26-2013, 03:12 PM
I usually try to stay away from the packaging game when talking about trades but I just read this:


The Pirates announced today that Jason Grilli (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/g/grillja01.shtml?utm_campaign=Linker&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker-www.typepad.com) has a flexor strain in his right arm. He is not a candidate for surgery, which is good news for the Bucs, but he will still miss four to eight weeks. Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports tweets (https://twitter.com/jonmorosi/status/360840944947433473) that the Pirates become more active in the bullpen trade market.

We have Morny. We have several bullpen arms. Seems like an even better fit now.

AROG
07-26-2013, 03:22 PM
I usually try to stay away from the packaging game when talking about trades but I just read this:


The Pirates announced today that Jason Grilli (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/g/grillja01.shtml?utm_campaign=Linker&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker-www.typepad.com) has a flexor strain in his right arm. He is not a candidate for surgery, which is good news for the Bucs, but he will still miss four to eight weeks. Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports tweets (https://twitter.com/jonmorosi/status/360840944947433473) that the Pirates become more active in the bullpen trade market.

We have Morny. We have several bullpen arms. Seems like an even better fit now.


I completely agree. Me might be able to package Perkins with Morny to get Reese McGuire and a MLB ready pitcher, like Andrew Oliver

cmb0252
07-26-2013, 03:29 PM
I completely agree. Me might be able to package Perkins with Morny to get Reese McGuire and a MLB ready pitcher, like Andrew Oliver

Recent draftees can't be traded for a year.

jay
07-26-2013, 03:38 PM
I completely agree. Me might be able to package Perkins with Morny to get Reese McGuire and a MLB ready pitcher, like Andrew Oliver

I think Morneau and Duensing would be more likely.

The Pirates aren't the type of team to trade for an established (read: overvalued) closer anyway -- look at how they've traded off their previous All-Star closers.

AROG
07-26-2013, 05:09 PM
I think Morneau and Duensing would be more likely.

The Pirates aren't the type of team to trade for an established (read: overvalued) closer anyway -- look at how they've traded off their previous All-Star closers.

They traded him because his contract was up and they didn't want to pay him the money. Perkins is under contract cheap for 3 years. Something a team like the Pirates would value a lot. The went with Grilli becasue he was cheap. For them, Morny is a complete rental with RBI potential and great defense. Perkins is the real piece of the trade. And I don't think they will over value him, but because their farm system is stacked, their 10th-30th best prospect is a much better prospect then we would get elsewhere, obvious exceptions to the Cardnals, Red Sox, and Astros. So we might get two prospects from them instead of three.

And since they can't trade McGuire I would say Tyler Glasnow and Wyatt Mathisen would be a good paring.

LimestoneBaggy
07-26-2013, 05:09 PM
If the Pirates wanted a trade for Morneau, it's certainly time to "buy-a-prospect" and eat his salary. I just can't get by the feeling that's where the trade talks break down.

AROG
07-26-2013, 05:26 PM
I think they are ready to eat his salary. They already have it budgeted to pay him. And honestly. I wouldn't doubt if the Twins signed him as a free agent over the winter. Its obvious that Parm can't handle it and until Sano is ready to take over third we don't need to transition Plouffe there.

diehardtwinsfan
07-26-2013, 05:28 PM
I completely agree. Me might be able to package Perkins with Morny to get Reese McGuire and a MLB ready pitcher, like Andrew Oliver

We drafted 3 catchers this year. No reason to go after a 4th that we passed up on. I'm guessing the Pirates won't want to pay for Perkins, but I wonder if we pry Hanson or one of their non-Tallison pitching prospects off of their hands for Morneau and Burton if we covered most of the salary.

AROG
07-26-2013, 05:36 PM
We drafted 3 catchers this year. No reason to go after a 4th that we passed up on. I'm guessing the Pirates won't want to pay for Perkins, but I wonder if we pry Hanson or one of their non-Tallison pitching prospects off of their hands for Morneau and Burton if we covered most of the salary.

I agree that we don't need another good catcher but we were very high on Reese (passed on him for a superior pitcher and he was gone later) and then we could trade the others when the start to develop. Catchers are always worth a premium and the Pirates have them in bunches. I would love to get Glasnow, I think he will be something really nice as he fills in his frame.

YourHouseIsMyHouse
07-26-2013, 05:57 PM
I usually try to stay away from the packaging game when talking about trades but I just read this:


The Pirates announced today that Jason Grilli (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/g/grillja01.shtml?utm_campaign=Linker&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker-www.typepad.com) has a flexor strain in his right arm. He is not a candidate for surgery, which is good news for the Bucs, but he will still miss four to eight weeks. Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports tweets (https://twitter.com/jonmorosi/status/360840944947433473) that the Pirates become more active in the bullpen trade market.

We have Morny. We have several bullpen arms. Seems like an even better fit now.


So Morneau and Burton for the rights to raid the Pirates farm.

AROG
07-26-2013, 06:12 PM
So Morneau and Burton for the rights to raid the Pirates farm.

No, I think that if Burton is traded with Morneau then we might get Oliver at best, and probably less then that. But if Perkins was packaged with Morneau I think we might get 2 good prospects.

stringer bell
07-26-2013, 06:43 PM
I doubt that both Perkins and Morneau would go to the Bucs. The Pirates will probably stick with their All-Star as the closer when both are healthy and they have a great setup guy and probably don't need two. Burton, Fien or Duensing would make some sense. I actually think the Twins should move Fien because he is overperforming while both Burton and Duensing are not.

mudcat14
07-26-2013, 07:16 PM
I doubt that both Perkins and Morneau would go to the Bucs. The Pirates will probably stick with their All-Star as the closer when both are healthy and they have a great setup guy and probably don't need two. Burton, Fien or Duensing would make some sense. I actually think the Twins should move Fien because he is overperforming while both Burton and Duensing are not.

Grilli is 36 years old, with 35 career saves (30 of which occurred this season.) Now he's got a Flexor injury that will sideline him for at least a month. Perkins, with his age, effectiveness & contract status would be a Wet Dream for the Pirates about now. A package with he & Morneau would certainly net us a bountiful return from the Bucs. Glasnow & another solid piece would be my expectation.

Jeremy Nygaard
07-26-2013, 08:56 PM
I can see how Andy Oliver could be a logical target, having been drafted out of high school by the Twins.

From what I've heard, Tyler Glasnow isn't going anywhere (unless maybe the return is significant).

After Pittsburgh was awarded the competitive balance pick, I immediately speculated that the Twins could be interested. Regardless, these teams match up well.

SirLoin
07-26-2013, 09:07 PM
What about Nick Kingham? He looks like that high strikeout pitcher that we're starting to add to the system.