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View Full Version : Heyman: Twins targeting Jackson, Marcum, McCarthy, others?



Jim Crikket
12-05-2012, 10:52 AM
From MLB Trade Rumors, John Heyman identifying (via twitter (http://twitter.com/JonHeymanCBS/status/276364757525725184)) Edwin Jackson, Shawn Marcum and Brandon McCarthy as potential targers. (Also Jair Jurrjens and Carl Pavano).

I'm not exactly sure what "identifying as potential targets" means, but if Heyman has information that the Twins are actually seriously involved with discussions for Jackson, Marcum and McCarthy, that would be more encouraging than anything else I've read this week.

Until Greinke signs and sets the market, these 3 probably aren't going to sign anywhere, so I won't expect deals done in Nashville.

Brock Beauchamp
12-05-2012, 10:56 AM
From MLB Trade Rumors, John Heyman identifying (via twitter (http://twitter.com/JonHeymanCBS/status/276364757525725184)) Edwin Jackson, Shawn Marcum and Brandon McCarthy as potential targers

Hey, those names aren't awful. Encouraging.

Jim Crikket
12-05-2012, 11:01 AM
From MLB Trade Rumors, John Heyman identifying (via twitter (http://twitter.com/JonHeymanCBS/status/276364757525725184)) Edwin Jackson, Shawn Marcum and Brandon McCarthy as potential targers

Hey, those names aren't awful. Encouraging.

Exactly.

Look, I've been a vocal skeptic, one might even say a cynic, this week (OK, not just this week). But like everyone else, I assume, I WANT to "believe" that Terry Ryan was serious about improving the rotation and this is the first indication I've read that even hints that he is. So I'll grasp at it.

Top Gun
12-05-2012, 11:02 AM
It means nothing, a dozen other teams target the same players with more money.

greengoblinrulz
12-05-2012, 11:11 AM
First 3 are encouraging YES......Jurrgens has much upside left.....dont like Saunders, but he had had some decent success
Pavano & Liriano are also 2 of the 7 contracts they have offerred......whats Kevin Slowey up to these days??

Im telling ya....they made offers to the first 3 that are just good enough to be turned down & Ryan/MN will do the 'we tried' approach & will settle for nothing of importance out of this rotation.
Ryan already knows his 2014 rotation is gonna consist of Diamond, Gibson, Meyer, Hendriks & maybe Appel, so he wont offer anything of length to the real pitchers & will be content to do 1yr deals with the leftovers.

Winston Smith
12-05-2012, 11:21 AM
I have seen a lot of the Twins have "checked in" with so & so and so & so. Re-cycled pabulum to fill pundit space, imo.

AllhopeisgoneMNTWINS
12-05-2012, 11:29 AM
Yeap like it continues to be said we will continue to hear the Twins are incquiring about every pitcher out in the market until Grienke signs his deal.

Twins Twerp
12-05-2012, 11:37 AM
Liriano and Sauders have no been given offers. I get Liriano, but aren't he and Saunders number 5 type guys?

ashburyjohn
12-05-2012, 11:52 AM
It means nothing, a dozen other teams target the same players with more money.

Yes and no. They won't all have the same time-frame as the Twins do, who are targeting 2015 more than 2013, and they don't all have the same urgency that Ryan does to reconstruct a destroyed rotation, so the contract offers won't be the same. Maybe Ryan can make some aspect of the multi-year be more attractive. I'm virtually certain that Ryan accepts that he'll have to "overpay" (whatever that means) to get one of this tier of pitcher. He also needs a second pitcher from a lower tier - I am thinking Saunders but others might be equivalent - and again must overpay a bit. After that, he can bargain hunt to fill out the rotation, or stand pat with the dregs he currently has under contract. 2015 is the main concern, but 2013-14 can not be left to decay to a 110-loss extent or the cash flow dries up alarmingly just when contention becomes possible.

ashburyjohn
12-05-2012, 11:57 AM
Liriano and Sauders have no been given offers. I get Liriano, but aren't he and Saunders number 5 type guys?

Looking at park adjusted ERA, Saunders has been average or above the past two years. If he's the best that we sign, then that's bad. But he can solidify a rotation better than calling him a #5, I think. Signing him plus someone better, we have a decent rotation that is simply missing a #1 guy. "Simply". Heh. No pennants, but not abject losing either.

SpiritofVodkaDave
12-05-2012, 11:59 AM
they made offers to the first 3 that are just good enough to be turned down & Ryan/MN will do the 'we tried' approach & will settle for nothing of importance out of this rotation.

What a refreshing and new take that I haven't read before! Please tell me more!

twinsfaninsaudi
12-05-2012, 12:04 PM
Ryan knows the 2014 rotation will be Diamond, Gibson, Meyer, Hendricks, and maybe Appel

Very true, and not a bad way of looking at things, he should be trying to build for that year. I think the kid out of Indiana State is more interesting than Appel. I personally hope that Hendricks is lined up as the 6th starter come 2014 and Salcedo has established himself as a viable option for the rotation over him.

But I do think it is definitely true that TR has an eye towards drafting a college pitcher with real potential to be in the 2014 rotation by mid-year. That is a factor in this offseason.

Twins Twerp
12-05-2012, 12:09 PM
Does Saunders being left handed jump him up two spots in a rotation?

twinsfaninsaudi
12-05-2012, 12:28 PM
It's just really doubtful That the twins are going to give out a Gil Meche like contract in order to attract one of the in-demand pitchers on the market. Therefore those pitchers will go to other teams that will easily match the twins offer and won't be as glaringly lined up for a losing season.

It means the pitchers that will have an incentive to sign with the twins are the ones who were kicked out of a rotation at some point within the last year because they have the incentive to sign somewhere without stiff competition for a rotation spot so they will be assured of being starters. So that means you're looking at Correia, Liriano, Jurrgens, and Lannan.

I think Meyer and Gibson will be in the rotation by July anyway and that Terry Ryan has no problem with that. So he won't mind signing someone from who he may only see a half season's worth of use, he has never minded doing that anyway with both position players and picthers.

Brock Beauchamp
12-05-2012, 12:32 PM
I think Meyer and Gibson will be in the rotation by July

Gibson, yes. Meyer, almost a zero chance of being in the rotation this July.

twinsfaninsaudi
12-05-2012, 12:40 PM
I think Meyer and Gibson will be in the rotation by July

Gibson, yes. Meyer, almost a zero chance of being in the rotation this July.

I think you're wrong. I understand your thinking, and mostly I'm going on a hunch, but I think he will arrive similar to Matt Garza in 2006. Meyer will be 23 in January. Liam Hendricks was 23 last year. This team does not have a lot of pitching. Zero chance? No.

Brock Beauchamp
12-05-2012, 12:43 PM
I think Meyer and Gibson will be in the rotation by July

Gibson, yes. Meyer, almost a zero chance of being in the rotation this July.

I think you're wrong. I understand your thinking, and mostly I'm going on a hunch, but I think he will arrive similar to Matt Garza in 2006. Meyer will be 23 in January. Liam Hendricks was 23 last year. This team does not have a lot of pitching. Zero chance? No.

Meyer has mechanical problems and an inconsistent delivery. The Twins won't rush him to the bigs until that is sorted out. I'd say 2014 at the earliest, given that he hasn't pitched above A ball.

twinsfaninsaudi
12-05-2012, 12:49 PM
I think Meyer and Gibson will be in the rotation by July

Gibson, yes. Meyer, almost a zero chance of being in the rotation this July.

I think you're wrong. I understand your thinking, and mostly I'm going on a hunch, but I think he will arrive similar to Matt Garza in 2006. Meyer will be 23 in January. Liam Hendricks was 23 last year. This team does not have a lot of pitching. Zero chance? No.

Meyer has mechanical problems and an inconsistent delivery. The Twins won't rush him to the bigs until that is sorted out. I'd say 2014 at the earliest, given that he hasn't pitched above A ball.

In every area that there is a concern about him he has improved steadily since being a sophomore in college, and he is not struggling with his control. Garza had not pitched above A ball going into 2006 either, he actually had less pro innings logged than going into that year than Meyer does now. If he dominates AA through May he will move to AAA by June and be in the bigs during the summer is he dominates there, maybe even if he is just solid.

greengoblinrulz
12-05-2012, 12:51 PM
no question to me that Meyer will be up this yr......I would guess July 31st we will deal a Liriano/Saunders type retread & we'll see him then.
I would predict we'll see Meyer in New Brit for 2-3months & with success a month or 2 in ROC.

twinsfaninsaudi
12-05-2012, 12:56 PM
no question to me that Meyer will be up this yr......I would guess July 31st we will deal a Liriano/Saunders type retread & we'll see him then.
I would predict we'll see Meyer in New Brit for 2-3months & with success a month or 2 in ROC.

I'm going to bring this to its own thread cause I am curious about what others have to say about it.