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mnfanforlife
11-07-2012, 06:20 PM
You can view the page at http://www.twinsdaily.com/content.php?1155-Let-it-Sano-Let-it-Sano-Let-it-Sano!

Seth Stohs
11-07-2012, 06:22 PM
I definitely have my thoughts, but I thought it would be interesting to hear other people's opinions before I weigh in with mine...

SeanS7921
11-07-2012, 06:38 PM
While his average isn't a huge deal his swings and misses are a huge deal when talking about moving a guy to the majors. 144 times in low A doesn't cry out ready for the Majors. You didn't even bring up that the guy has no true position in the field and at this point will probably be a RF, DH or 1B guy. 3B is highly dubious. If he can't play 3rd it limits his upside. Byron Buxton is most likely the Twins top prospect and then Sano. We bring up Sano and waste his service time when he's not ready. He isn't close to the prospect Harper is. Not even close. Hopefully Sano will be ready for some big league ball by 2015.

mnfanforlife
11-07-2012, 07:04 PM
My point was that, in my opinion, when you push a top-prospect to a level out of their comfort zone (like in Haprer's case), they are more MLB ready quicker. And I would say that Harper and Sano are comparable when it comes to offensive production. Harper is better, but Sano is close. Closer than you would admit. We will never know how good Sano is at this age, since he hasnt been pushed at all through the minor league system, despite his status as an elite prospect.

mnfanforlife
11-07-2012, 07:05 PM
Sano will likely be a DH in the majors. So Harper has a big advantage there.

h2oface
11-07-2012, 07:21 PM
i have never bought into the stance that you hurt a young man to let him struggle a bit as you let him compete at the level that pushes him. you see it happen too often for other teams.... but the twins tend to bury their guys. or maybe.... they just don't pick as well as they promote they do, and don't have the minor league system they claim. how can it be worse than watching a team lose 99 and 96 2 years in row? you never know if you don't give them a shot. right anthony slama?

greengoblinrulz
11-07-2012, 07:43 PM
You have your conservative approach....which is the Twins (minors are important & dont hurt your minor league teams to improve yourself....ok a lil tuff but).
The other approach is that players are ONLY in the minors to get them ready to help out the MLB team.
I didnt comlain too much last yr on Sano AS I compare him to Miguel Cabrera, who was called up in July of his 20th bday season (next yr for Sano). Miguel did a half year at High A/half at AA, so next year is where I am gonna be critical of MN on the promotions (of course IF Sano deserves it).

Jim H
11-07-2012, 07:51 PM
We seem to have these debates about promoting prospects all the time. Why did you pick Harper as a comp? Maybe Delmon Young would be a better comp. He was a guy who didn't have a defensive position, was a highly regarded prospect, was promoted very quickly, and has never really come close to fullfilling his promise.

Here's the thing. When the Twins have a prospect who deserves to be promoted quickly (Mauer, Kubel), they promote them quickly. I believe Sano may very well be a super prospect, but he had struggles at times last year. His numbers really never screamed Promote Me. I suspect that he begins at Fort Myers next spring. If he dominates, he goes to AA. If he dominates there, he goes to AAA. More likely he moves slower than that, because they won't want to give him more than he can handle.

Most times prospects dictate where they play by how they play.

mnfanforlife
11-07-2012, 07:57 PM
Delmon is a decent comparison for Sano, but Delmon was pushed through the minors quickly like Harper. Delmon played in AAA at age 19. Sano just finished low-A ball at 19. So that isnt a fair comparison either.

mnfanforlife
11-07-2012, 08:01 PM
We will never know what type of impact Sano could have created in the Majors as a 19 yr-old like Harper or other uber-prospects. But, it definitely generates some conversation. And I would rather side with those that think pushing a top-prospect up quickly is in everyone's best interest, than side with those that want to save on MLB service time and all that yuck yuck. As a teacher, you push kids into their "zone of proximal development." And Sano has not been challenged or in his "zone" by any means. He has been a jewel in a league full of rocks the last two years.

minn55441
11-07-2012, 08:03 PM
I agree that both Harper and Sano are elite level talent, but from there we have two different players.
1) Harper is as equally advanced in the field as he is at the plate. Sano if promoted too quickly now, would end up being a career DH. He needs a chance to advance as a fielder. It will only hurt him in the long run to slot him into a DH only position.
2) Harper grew up in the US and speaks english. As much as learning the game, Sano has had to learn about life in the US and adjust what a ballplayers life is like away from the diamond. We would be setting him up for failure to stick him on a huge stage before he has the maturity to deal with it.
3) Sano has specific things to work on even at the low A level in terms of both field and hitting. You can learn from success and failure. He is seeing both at his current level in the organization.

Would I like to see him play at Hi-A to start next year and finish the season at AA? sure, but he will need to earn it by cutting down on his strikeouts and improving his fielding.

mnfanforlife
11-07-2012, 08:07 PM
Honestly, i would have liked to see him skip Elizabethton and play in Beloit as an 18-yr-old. Then get into the Florida State league last year (2012), and have a fighting chance as a 20-yr-old to get a September call-up. I think he would have been ready for this type of schedule, but we will never know.

Seth Stohs
11-07-2012, 08:22 PM
Delmon is a decent comparison for Sano, but Delmon was pushed through the minors quickly like Harper. Delmon played in AAA at age 19. Sano just finished low-A ball at 19. So that isnt a fair comparison either.

Maybe not, but that is certainly the risk of rushing someone too quickly. Guys like Griffey Jr, Harper, Trout, Cabrera, they are the RARE exceptions. Trout and Harper didn't strikeout nearly as much as Sano did. They were all terrific defensively.

I'm not at all ready to say the Twins are moving Sano too slowly. He put up very good power numbers in Low A (and was still a good 2 years younger than the average player there), but he struggled with the defensive side of the game, and he struggled making contact at times, he had a couple of pretty big slumps. And, there have always been maturity questions about Sano (which I heard he greatly improved this year).

I see them moving him at the Mauer/Revere pace, which is incredibly quickly. But he's going to have to warrant that promotion next year.

mnfanforlife
11-07-2012, 08:28 PM
yes those guys are rare exceptions. I was really hoping that Sano was going to be one of those rare types. But he is just a tick below that status.

Brad Swanson
11-07-2012, 09:17 PM
One other point, regarding Harper, is that Washington was a contending team that needed him in the outfield. The Twins aren't very good and don't really need another CI/DH type right now.

Letting Sano develop in the low minors can only help his confidence and help enhance his tools. I'd prefer to see prospects skip higher levels, rather than the lower levels. That is just my preference though.

jboshe4
11-07-2012, 09:24 PM
For what its worth I saw Sano in June for a couple games, and if I remember right it was before he had hit any of his big slumps. Anyway, he didn't look at all like a guy that would've been able to handle any sort of advanced pitching at that point. He was very Pedro Cerrano-esque, straight ball hit it very much. Curveball, bats are afraid. I don't think he even made contact with and breaking pitch, and took several for strikes.

I think his numbers were probably more a product of a guy who can absolutely punish mistakes, which are plentiful in Low-A. That said he seemed to have decent approach in that he knew he could wait to try and get in a good count and then hit straight ball. However, that approach will not play so well at higher levels.

Not to be entirely negative, I still think he has tons of potential and love that he's in our system and am very excited about him. But from my view, he didn't really look like a guy that should be on an highly accelerated timeline, especially with the lack of defensive value.

Brad Swanson
11-07-2012, 09:30 PM
I think I remember either Kevin Goldstein or Jason Parks on an Up and In podcast early in the season hypothesizing on how Sano would do in the Majors. If I remember right, they thought he would hit about .100 and strike out over 300 times. Now, they are obviously just theorizing, but that might not be all that far off. He did strike out 140 times against Low A pitching.

This isn't even a critique of his skills, just where he was in his development before the season. He'll work out those issues as he ages and develops.

Big City
11-07-2012, 09:41 PM
Comparing Sano to Harper is tough for me to make because Harper physically looks the same today then he did when he was drafted. Sano on the other hand came into our organization much younger than Harper and has physically matured from being a medium sized SS to a taller beefier version of himself. That's why I don't see the rush to promote him through the ranks and sacrifice his value by playing him as a DH, 1B, or RF. According to scouts, his coordination even in the AFL has improved giving him positive defensive reviews. I'd give Sano another year or two to physically develop and improve his 3B defense in the minors especially consdering he's on the same trajectory to be promoted with Rosario and Arcia. A 2014 IF consisting of Mauer, Parmalee, Rosario and Sano with Arcia, Revere and Hicks in the OF is my manifest destiny.

Mave
11-07-2012, 09:49 PM
In two seasons in the Minor leagues, Bryce Harper committed 12 errors, while learning a new position... Heck, Delmon committed only 20 errors in 5 minor league seasons. I understand that looking at the number of errors alone doesn't make for a strong argument in the day and age of fancy calculators, but Sano has committed 90 errors already over three seasons. That's pretty heavy.

I also completely agree with the point that Sano was also in need some time to adapt to life in America/speaking a new language. One of his biggest concerns about playing in Wisconsin this past year was that it is such a radically cold climate compared to anything he has ever known!! That isn't a lifestyle/life decision I (or many people for that matter) will ever be able to appreciate or understand. I think that this point also has merit.

Twins Twerp
11-07-2012, 09:50 PM
We will never know what type of impact Sano could have created in the Majors as a 19 yr-old like Harper or other uber-prospects. But, it definitely generates some conversation. And I would rather side with those that think pushing a top-prospect up quickly is in everyone's best interest, than side with those that want to save on MLB service time and all that yuck yuck. As a teacher, you push kids into their "zone of proximal development." And Sano has not been challenged or in his "zone" by any means. He has been a jewel in a league full of rocks the last two years.

Nice zone of proximal development self. I agree 100 % with the argument. No reason to rush him when his defense needs so much work and he still strikes out at a very high rate.

Just to throw some more teaching jargon out there for you...bringing Sano up at a slow pace may be the "least restrictive environment," but also may trigger a "looking glass self" as he performs to level he is at. If he were to be put into a situation where he is facing better compition, who is to say he doesn't step up the the plate (baseball cliche)?

mnfanforlife
11-07-2012, 09:55 PM
One other point, regarding Harper, is that Washington was a contending team that needed him in the outfield. The Twins aren't very good and don't really need another CI/DH type right now.

Letting Sano develop in the low minors can only help his confidence and help enhance his tools. I'd prefer to see prospects skip higher levels, rather than the lower levels. That is just my preference though.

I agree that they need to skip levels, but i think they should skip the levels they will easily dominate. And play at the upper levels as an outlier age-wise.

Brad Swanson
11-07-2012, 09:57 PM
So, is this just a community filled with teachers?

The risk with pushing gifted "students" like Sano is that you can burn them out. You want to keep them challenged, but you still need to nurture their developmental and social needs. Sano likely does need more of a cultural adjustment than Harper, and that plays a role in his development.

We can't create gaps in his learning :)

mnfanforlife
11-07-2012, 10:01 PM
We will never know what type of impact Sano could have created in the Majors as a 19 yr-old like Harper or other uber-prospects. But, it definitely generates some conversation. And I would rather side with those that think pushing a top-prospect up quickly is in everyone's best interest, than side with those that want to save on MLB service time and all that yuck yuck. As a teacher, you push kids into their "zone of proximal development." And Sano has not been challenged or in his "zone" by any means. He has been a jewel in a league full of rocks the last two years.

Nice zone of proximal development self. I agree 100 % with the argument. No reason to rush him when his defense needs so much work and he still strikes out at a very high rate.

Just to throw some more teaching jargon out there for you...bringing Sano up at a slow pace may be the "least restrictive environment," but also may trigger a "looking glass self" as he performs to level he is at. If he were to be put into a situation where he is facing better compition, who is to say he doesn't step up the the plate (baseball cliche)?

Exactly! i just wish we could have seen him struggle at a higher level last year (and the year before for that matter). He is known as a stud back home (#1 overall pick in the Dominican Winter League draft), so maybe he does figure things out quicker if he gets challenged early as a 18-19-yr-old

peterukavina
11-07-2012, 10:03 PM
I think you need to look at the years of control and his contribution during those years. If he's not going to help the club that much, why start his eligibility?

Brad Swanson
11-07-2012, 10:06 PM
I think you need to look at the years of control and his contribution during those years. If he's not going to help the club that much, why start his eligibility?

This is a huge factor for me too. I don't like the Twins being cheap, but if you bring Sano up for a couple years and he is brutal, you waste two years of his service time and two years of his development.

I would feel a lot differently if Sano was 21, played third well and the Twins were a borderline playoff team.

mnfanforlife
11-07-2012, 10:10 PM
I think you need to look at the years of control and his contribution during those years. If he's not going to help the club that much, why start his eligibility?

This is a huge factor for me too. I don't like the Twins being cheap, but if you bring Sano up for a couple years and he is brutal, you waste two years of his service time and two years of his development.

I would feel a lot differently if Sano was 21, played third well and the Twins were a borderline playoff team.

I complete agree he isnt going to fly through the minors like Harper did. But I was hopin to see him move multiple low-levels per year to speed things up a bit. The Twins haven't seemed to let anyone skip AAA lately. Which means Sano could be looking at 3 more years in the minors before he gets a full season in the majors.

minn55441
11-07-2012, 10:27 PM
[/QUOTE]The Twins haven't seemed to let anyone skip AAA lately. Which means Sano could be looking at 3 more years in the minors before he gets a full season in the majors.[/QUOTE]

Both Benson and Parmelee skipped AAA in Sept of 2011. It was a good call up for both, however both went different directions in 2012.

70charger
11-07-2012, 10:31 PM
Most of my points have already been made. 1) He's defensively pretty bad and needs seasoning. 2) He strikes out too much and needs to work on hitting certain pitches. 3) If we start his service clock when both he and the Twins are going to do nothing but suck, we're wasting time that's under team control.

One thing that bugs me is this constantly repeated idea that the Twins don't promote their minor league players fast enough. Usually the evidence is one of two things: a comparison to a non-comparable player (as here), or treating unrepresentative players as typical of the system. Every player is different. I think many people here would be surprised at how alike minor league systems and promotions are.

OldManWinter
11-07-2012, 11:29 PM
I agree with 70charger on his last comment.

People often express a degree of suspicion, conspiracy, and intrigue toward the Twins management.

I ask, what management group in their right mind would fail to move players up when they are ready? Or, if the team has a need fir their talents? The careers of decision makers jobs depend upon making correct decisions.

Teams would be cutting their own throats if they made decisions other than when they think players are truly ready. After all, they play in a highly competitive environment where they can ill afford to make decisions based on factors other than performance.

SpantheMan
11-07-2012, 11:31 PM
If you promote prospects up to the upper minors, you increase the chance of them stalling out in AA. Sano is doing very well but he also has many things to work on. He's unrefined. He still strikes out a ton and plays raw defense

Monkeypaws
11-07-2012, 11:49 PM
Consider this - according to BA, Sano was the 6th youngest guy in the Midwest league: http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/prospects/2012/04/the-youngest-players-in-each-full-season-league/

Hard to say he's being held back.

glunn
11-08-2012, 12:33 AM
For what its worth I saw Sano in June for a couple games, and if I remember right it was before he had hit any of his big slumps. Anyway, he didn't look at all like a guy that would've been able to handle any sort of advanced pitching at that point. He was very Pedro Cerrano-esque, straight ball hit it very much. Curveball, bats are afraid. I don't think he even made contact with and breaking pitch, and took several for strikes.

I think his numbers were probably more a product of a guy who can absolutely punish mistakes, which are plentiful in Low-A. That said he seemed to have decent approach in that he knew he could wait to try and get in a good count and then hit straight ball. However, that approach will not play so well at higher levels.

Not to be entirely negative, I still think he has tons of potential and love that he's in our system and am very excited about him. But from my view, he didn't really look like a guy that should be on an highly accelerated timeline, especially with the lack of defensive value.

I love this post.

mlhouse
11-08-2012, 12:39 AM
I have been arguing this point for two years now. THe Twins approach to their minor league system is too conservative. A few years ago, when the team was at least a contender for the playoffs it was probably the best approach. But now, as a rebuilding team, it isn't.

Aaron Hicks NEEDS to be the starting OF for the Twins next year. No partial season in AAA. Major league. Same with Gibson in the rotation. Sano and Rosario need to be looked at too during the course of the season. I think the Twins need to keep Joe Benson as a backup OF and see if he can do anything. If the management cannot tell if they are keepers and can be developed they are not doing their jobs and need to be fired. This is our reality going forward.

So, why the hell not? After consecutive 95+ loss seasons they have nothing really to lose. To not do this means that they simply cannot or will not develop young players at the major league level. Listen, this worked in 1982. After a couple of rough years, it paid off. Hrbek(21 years old), Gaetti (22 years old), Puckett(23 years old), Viola(22 years old), Bush, Gagne, and Launder were all players "rushed" from the minors.

Puckett played a short season rookie year, a full season of A+, 21 games at AAA and then to the majors. Viola started in AA, pitched 8 games in AAA the next year before he was called up to the majors. Hrbek played a short rookie year, A-, and A+ when he was called up to the majors. Gaetti short rookie, full A, almost a full year in AA and then late season call up. But, they got to the majors really young, worked out their problems at the major league level, LOST lots of games and but in the end, it all turned out alright.

mlhouse
11-08-2012, 12:45 AM
I left off Brunansky too, mainly because he was a minor league product of the Angels system. His career path was a 17 year old Rookie ball player, A+ as an 18 year old, AA as a 19 with a late season 9 game stint in AAA. AAA as a 20 year old with call up to major leagues. Traded to Minnesota as a 21 year old, 25 games in AAA and 127 games as a major leaguer.

Or Tim Tuefel. He was a college 2nd round draft pick and started his short season in AA. At age of 22 full AA season, followed by a split AA/AAA year. As 24 year old he did AAA and was late call up to the Twins.

Think about what their career projections would be following the Twins standard?

diehardtwinsfan
11-08-2012, 07:10 AM
I think you need to look at the years of control and his contribution during those years. If he's not going to help the club that much, why start his eligibility?

This is a huge factor for me too. I don't like the Twins being cheap, but if you bring Sano up for a couple years and he is brutal, you waste two years of his service time and two years of his development.

I would feel a lot differently if Sano was 21, played third well and the Twins were a borderline playoff team.

This isn't about being cheap, it's about being smart. 95 loss teams are not being wise in promoting their top prospects well before they are ready so that they can burn service time struggling in ML. It's going to be a tough jump as it is, and bringing them on before the skillset is there is a good way to destroy a kid's confidence or burn valuable service time. Even the Yankees understand that concept. If you bring Sano up too soon, you have two possible results: 1) He struggles and never reaches that potential (example: Delmon Young, Carlos Gomez). 2) He gets good right when he gets expensive. The Twins are in a position where the second option isn't always a bad thing, but regardless, it's poor management from a long term organizational standpoint, and it's risky from a player development standpoint.

Likewise, I fail to see how the Twins are being conservative. Sano is very young for his league. He didn't exactly dominate either, which makes me think they put him in the proper zone of proximal development, or whatever you want to call it. His defense is clearly lagging and other than power, his offense wasn't exactly top tier either. I'm not saying he's a bad prospect, but he was challenged quite well based on where his skills are now. Putting him in Fort Myers or New Brittian for 2012 makes that challenge even tougher. People who say push push push seem to forget that the skill level between the minor league levels is much more difficult. Not much is going to be accomplished when you put a guy who needs to hone his contact tools against people who are much better at avoiding contact, and we can find story after story about guys who got pushed too fast and never made it. It isn't about being conservative or liberal with your prospects. It's about being smart. Sano has shown nothing to indicate that the Twins are being too conservative with him.

mnfanforlife
11-08-2012, 08:58 AM
I left off Brunansky too, mainly because he was a minor league product of the Angels system. His career path was a 17 year old Rookie ball player, A+ as an 18 year old, AA as a 19 with a late season 9 game stint in AAA. AAA as a 20 year old with call up to major leagues. Traded to Minnesota as a 21 year old, 25 games in AAA and 127 games as a major leaguer.

Or Tim Tuefel. He was a college 2nd round draft pick and started his short season in AA. At age of 22 full AA season, followed by a split AA/AAA year. As 24 year old he did AAA and was late call up to the Twins.

Think about what their career projections would be following the Twins standard?


I absolutely agree that the Twins have been too conservative lately with their top prospects. As I stated in the comments above, i would have loved to see Sano/Rosario skip ELZ altogether and have a shot to play AA by 20/21 yrs old. But its looking like a full season at A+ next summer for both. Also stated earlier was that if top prospects are pushed to AA or AAA they will get a whole lot better faster than if they light up Rookie ball twice, then spend an entire summer at low-A, then another at A+, and so on....But we wont know if Sano/Rosario would have been capable of that advanced schedule, because they were coddled as teenagers, in my opinion.

mnfanforlife
11-08-2012, 09:22 AM
If you promote prospects up to the upper minors, you increase the chance of them stalling out in AA. Sano is doing very well but he also has many things to work on. He's unrefined. He still strikes out a ton and plays raw defense

I agree he is not yet ready for big-time production at AA or AAA or MLB. But I would have liked to see him struggle at an advanced level rather than spend his first 3 years kicking the crap out of leagues where he is probably the best overall player (in the league). Who knows, he may have hit .238 in A+ last year with 21 HR's and 80 RBI....I would push those offensive numbers up to AA in 2013 regardless of strikeouts and inconsistent defense (which is said to be improving fast (could it have improved faster if he were pushed to higher levels earlier?)). We just will never know with Sano, since he wasn't given the opportunity​ to struggle (yet).

mnfanforlife
11-08-2012, 09:37 AM
I think you need to look at the years of control and his contribution during those years. If he's not going to help the club that much, why start his eligibility?

This is a huge factor for me too. I don't like the Twins being cheap, but if you bring Sano up for a couple years and he is brutal, you waste two years of his service time and two years of his development.

I would feel a lot differently if Sano was 21, played third well and the Twins were a borderline playoff team.

This isn't about being cheap, it's about being smart. 95 loss teams are not being wise in promoting their top prospects well before they are ready so that they can burn service time struggling in ML. It's going to be a tough jump as it is, and bringing them on before the skillset is there is a good way to destroy a kid's confidence or burn valuable service time. Even the Yankees understand that concept. If you bring Sano up too soon, you have two possible results: 1) He struggles and never reaches that potential (example: Delmon Young, Carlos Gomez). 2) He gets good right when he gets expensive. The Twins are in a position where the second option isn't always a bad thing, but regardless, it's poor management from a long term organizational standpoint, and it's risky from a player development standpoint.

Likewise, I fail to see how the Twins are being conservative. Sano is very young for his league. He didn't exactly dominate either, which makes me think they put him in the proper zone of proximal development, or whatever you want to call it. His defense is clearly lagging and other than power, his offense wasn't exactly top tier either. I'm not saying he's a bad prospect, but he was challenged quite well based on where his skills are now. Putting him in Fort Myers or New Brittian for 2012 makes that challenge even tougher. People who say push push push seem to forget that the skill level between the minor league levels is much more difficult. Not much is going to be accomplished when you put a guy who needs to hone his contact tools against people who are much better at avoiding contact, and we can find story after story about guys who got pushed too fast and never made it. It isn't about being conservative or liberal with your prospects. It's about being smart. Sano has shown nothing to indicate that the Twins are being too conservative with him.


I completely agree that Sano is not ready for MLB playing time now or was last year in 2012. Not even close. But I would have loved to see him get a shot at moving from Beloit to Ft. Myers to end last season, at the very minimum. His batting average was not dominant, but his total offensive production was. He won the HR & RBI crowns with ease, even though he was 19 playing in a 22-yr-olds league. And like I mentioned earlier, who's to say that Sano could not have handled Beloit in 2011 rather than a second year of short-season Rookie ball. Its all conjecture, but we could have had a more polished/valuable product sooner if he were challenged even more than he already has been.

markominne
11-08-2012, 09:58 AM
I have been arguing this point for two years now. THe Twins approach to their minor league system is too conservative. A few years ago, when the team was at least a contender for the playoffs it was probably the best approach. But now, as a rebuilding team, it isn't.

Aaron Hicks NEEDS to be the starting OF for the Twins next year. No partial season in AAA. Major league. Same with Gibson in the rotation. Sano and Rosario need to be looked at too during the course of the season. I think the Twins need to keep Joe Benson as a backup OF and see if he can do anything. If the management cannot tell if they are keepers and can be developed they are not doing their jobs and need to be fired. This is our reality going forward.

So, why the hell not? After consecutive 95+ loss seasons they have nothing really to lose. To not do this means that they simply cannot or will not develop young players at the major league level. Listen, this worked in 1982. After a couple of rough years, it paid off. Hrbek(21 years old), Gaetti (22 years old), Puckett(23 years old), Viola(22 years old), Bush, Gagne, and Launder were all players "rushed" from the minors.

Puckett played a short season rookie year, a full season of A+, 21 games at AAA and then to the majors. Viola started in AA, pitched 8 games in AAA the next year before he was called up to the majors. Hrbek played a short rookie year, A-, and A+ when he was called up to the majors. Gaetti short rookie, full A, almost a full year in AA and then late season call up. But, they got to the majors really young, worked out their problems at the major league level, LOST lots of games and but in the end, it all turned out alright.

For those of us pushing for moving prospects into the major leagues faster, I will point out that the 1982 Twins lost 102 games. Plus, when they are losing with these guys, I already can hear the complaining about the "cheap Pohlads" for playing minimum-salary player who should be in the minor leagues. One other thought: While the '82 team was the foundation of tehe '87 world champions, let's not glamorize the 1987 Twins, or lose sight of the fact that they were a severely flawed team with only 2 effective starting pitchers. They caught lightening in a bottle by being in the right division (they won the division with 85 wins), and getting hot at the right time. They took a chance with that core group, and got lucky in '87.

I agree that players who are ready can and should move through the minors quickly. But that is clearly not the case with Sano; 90 errors in the 3 years would make him a 20-year-old DH who struggles to hit breaking pitches.Similarly, someone suggested putting Joe Benson on the 25-man in 2013 "to see what he can do": In 2012 he was demoted early for terrible production, then was injured for most of the remainder of the season. If you recall, he and Parmalee were recalled in 2011, and while Parmalee excelled, Benson looked like a guy snatched out of AA-ball without the tools to play in the major leagues.

Personally, I'll side with Ryan and see if he can pull together a competitive club in 2013 by adding pitching, and give most of these guys at least another year in the minors. Sano is NOT Bryce Harper, and rushing him, Rosaria, Arcia, Benson, et al, onto the major leagues is going to hurt the team in the near term, with no evidence it would help them longer-term.

Physics Guy
11-08-2012, 09:59 AM
I have so many things swimming in my head regarding all of the comments; many well thought out arguments. I was actually arguing with a colleague about Sano yesterday.

I don't see the Twins accelerating his promotion for two reasons:
1) I agree that he probably needs to work on pitch recognition/hitting breaking pitches as evidenced from his K levels.
2) Primarily because the Twins are holding out that he can play 3B. He clearly is not ready to play 3B anywhere near the level needed in the majors.

Harper flew through the minors because the decision was made to not keep him at a tougher defensive position. Remember he was originally a catcher. Boras wanted his path to the majors as short as possible.

The Twins, in my opinion, are doing the right thing. Sano is much more valuable at 3B than he is at 1B, RF or especially DH. It's the same reason you keep Mauer at catcher as long as possible. As a 1B, Mauer's comparable is something akin to Mark Grace. As a C he's a future HOF. Keeping Sano at 3B will require extra time in the minors, but I think they need to decide this year if he indeed can stay at 3B.

Larsbars08
11-08-2012, 10:02 AM
I'm pretty sure a ton of Sano's strikeouts came during his awful month plus long slump. When he finally recovered in the last third of the season he struck out a lot less. I'm hoping he can develop more consistency throughout the season, everyone has slumps, but month long slumps are brutal and as Sano develops, I have confidence he will limit his strike outs. He's never going to be Joe Mauer, but I don't think he's Adam Dunn yet. All the scouts I've heard who have seen him, Kevin Goldstein, Keith Law, etc. were all surprised that his approach at the plate was surprisingly patient. They said he occasionally still swung at outside pitches, but he had vastly improved from the last time they had seen him. I'm really interested to see how he plays next year because the Florida State League is where hitters really start to face good breaking balls from usually more developed pitchers. I could easily see Sano starting out slow before figuring it out. I think next season will be where we really see what we've got with Sano.
He's still 19, he may never be a good 3rd basemen but he has plenty of time to learn the position before we have to really worry about moving him to the outfield.

righty8383
11-08-2012, 11:04 AM
I went to Appleton, WI for a couple games last year in June. Obviously Sano was my main point of focus. The 1st thing I noticed was that he was seeing about 70% breaking balls(no joke). The problem was, he wasn't giving pitchers a reason to throw him anything else. He had a couple AB's where he looked foolish hacking away a pitches in the dirt. His defense looked fine when I was there. He did miss a hot shot that short hopped him and it was ruled a hit.

The 2nd game I saw was pretty good for him. He hit a solid line drive single in his 1st AB. Struck out his 2nd AB. His 3rd AB was with the bases loaded and 2 outs. This was the one AB where he actually looked like a real professional. He quickly found himself in an 0-2 hole. He took a high fastball. The 1-2 pitch was an ankle high breaking ball. Sano flinched at it but laid off. He then fouled off a high fastball. Finally the pitcher made the mistake Sano was looking for, a belt high hanger that was launched about 430 ft for a grand slam.

I'm actually glad to know that Sano has been seeing so many breaking balls, it can only help him get better at recognizing these pitches and laying off the bad ones. Next year the pitchers will only get better and the FSL is a pitchers league. I still expect Sano to hit for good power though.

jtrinaldi
11-08-2012, 04:25 PM
I went to Appleton, WI for a couple games last year in June. Obviously Sano was my main point of focus. The 1st thing I noticed was that he was seeing about 70% breaking balls(no joke). The problem was, he wasn't giving pitchers a reason to throw him anything else. He had a couple AB's where he looked foolish hacking away a pitches in the dirt. His defense looked fine when I was there. He did miss a hot shot that short hopped him and it was ruled a hit.

The 2nd game I saw was pretty good for him. He hit a solid line drive single in his 1st AB. Struck out his 2nd AB. His 3rd AB was with the bases loaded and 2 outs. This was the one AB where he actually looked like a real professional. He quickly found himself in an 0-2 hole. He took a high fastball. The 1-2 pitch was an ankle high breaking ball. Sano flinched at it but laid off. He then fouled off a high fastball. Finally the pitcher made the mistake Sano was looking for, a belt high hanger that was launched about 430 ft for a grand slam.

I'm actually glad to know that Sano has been seeing so many breaking balls, it can only help him get better at recognizing these pitches and laying off the bad ones. Next year the pitchers will only get better and the FSL is a pitchers league. I still expect Sano to hit for good power though.
Were you at the game when he hit the Grand Slam?

mnfanforlife
11-08-2012, 04:42 PM
I went to Appleton, WI for a couple games last year in June. Obviously Sano was my main point of focus. The 1st thing I noticed was that he was seeing about 70% breaking balls(no joke). The problem was, he wasn't giving pitchers a reason to throw him anything else. He had a couple AB's where he looked foolish hacking away a pitches in the dirt. His defense looked fine when I was there. He did miss a hot shot that short hopped him and it was ruled a hit.

The 2nd game I saw was pretty good for him. He hit a solid line drive single in his 1st AB. Struck out his 2nd AB. His 3rd AB was with the bases loaded and 2 outs. This was the one AB where he actually looked like a real professional. He quickly found himself in an 0-2 hole. He took a high fastball. The 1-2 pitch was an ankle high breaking ball. Sano flinched at it but laid off. He then fouled off a high fastball. Finally the pitcher made the mistake Sano was looking for, a belt high hanger that was launched about 430 ft for a grand slam.

I'm actually glad to know that Sano has been seeing so many breaking balls, it can only help him get better at recognizing these pitches and laying off the bad ones. Next year the pitchers will only get better and the FSL is a pitchers league. I still expect Sano to hit for good power though.

This is great stuff! No doubt Sano will strikeout a ton in the majors....but he will be productive like many of the high K/high power hitters making millions today

mlhouse
11-09-2012, 12:35 AM
I have been arguing this point for two years now. THe Twins approach to their minor league system is too conservative. A few years ago, when the team was at least a contender for the playoffs it was probably the best approach. But now, as a rebuilding team, it isn't.

Aaron Hicks NEEDS to be the starting OF for the Twins next year. No partial season in AAA. Major league. Same with Gibson in the rotation. Sano and Rosario need to be looked at too during the course of the season. I think the Twins need to keep Joe Benson as a backup OF and see if he can do anything. If the management cannot tell if they are keepers and can be developed they are not doing their jobs and need to be fired. This is our reality going forward.

So, why the hell not? After consecutive 95+ loss seasons they have nothing really to lose. To not do this means that they simply cannot or will not develop young players at the major league level. Listen, this worked in 1982. After a couple of rough years, it paid off. Hrbek(21 years old), Gaetti (22 years old), Puckett(23 years old), Viola(22 years old), Bush, Gagne, and Launder were all players "rushed" from the minors.

Puckett played a short season rookie year, a full season of A+, 21 games at AAA and then to the majors. Viola started in AA, pitched 8 games in AAA the next year before he was called up to the majors. Hrbek played a short rookie year, A-, and A+ when he was called up to the majors. Gaetti short rookie, full A, almost a full year in AA and then late season call up. But, they got to the majors really young, worked out their problems at the major league level, LOST lots of games and but in the end, it all turned out alright.

For those of us pushing for moving prospects into the major leagues faster, I will point out that the 1982 Twins lost 102 games. Plus, when they are losing with these guys, I already can hear the complaining about the "cheap Pohlads" for playing minimum-salary player who should be in the minor leagues. One other thought: While the '82 team was the foundation of tehe '87 world champions, let's not glamorize the 1987 Twins, or lose sight of the fact that they were a severely flawed team with only 2 effective starting pitchers. They caught lightening in a bottle by being in the right division (they won the division with 85 wins), and getting hot at the right time. They took a chance with that core group, and got lucky in '87.

I agree that players who are ready can and should move through the minors quickly. But that is clearly not the case with Sano; 90 errors in the 3 years would make him a 20-year-old DH who struggles to hit breaking pitches.Similarly, someone suggested putting Joe Benson on the 25-man in 2013 "to see what he can do": In 2012 he was demoted early for terrible production, then was injured for most of the remainder of the season. If you recall, he and Parmalee were recalled in 2011, and while Parmalee excelled, Benson looked like a guy snatched out of AA-ball without the tools to play in the major leagues.

Personally, I'll side with Ryan and see if he can pull together a competitive club in 2013 by adding pitching, and give most of these guys at least another year in the minors. Sano is NOT Bryce Harper, and rushing him, Rosaria, Arcia, Benson, et al, onto the major leagues is going to hurt the team in the near term, with no evidence it would help them longer-term.

Who cares how many games the Twins lost in 1982. That is the point. When you are losing, rebuild. After two 95+ loss seasons what players have the Twins developed for the long run? Get the prospects, like Joe Benson, up to the major leagues and see what they can do. From the 1982 team there were several guys who made it and a few that did not, like Dave Engle, Lenny Faedo, and Brad Havens. Rebuilding is a two step process: develop the guys who are good and weed out and replace the guys who are not. By moving early on Lenny Faedo they got Greg Gagne up to replace him. If you move conservatively you will not get that information.

mlhouse
11-09-2012, 01:00 AM
Lets look at another historical example, Chuck Knoblauch. Drafted in 1989 at the end of the first round he started played 50 games at A- and 20 at A+. In 1990 he was in AA. And in 1991 he was with the Twins.

Following the Twins current conservative path, he would have played 1989 at Elizabethton and maybe the end of the year at Beloit. He would have started 1990 in Beloit, then maybe part of the season in Ft Myers. If he was really good they would have had him in New Britain in 1991 and maybe a shot at the end of the season with the MLB team. So, Knoblauch might have made the Twins at the end of the season he was ROY in. THis was mainly the path Mauer took (Rookie--->A---->A+/AA--->A+/AAA/MLB).

70charger
11-09-2012, 01:44 AM
Lets look at another historical example, Chuck Knoblauch. Drafted in 1989 at the end of the first round he started played 50 games at A- and 20 at A+. In 1990 he was in AA. And in 1991 he was with the Twins.

Following the Twins current conservative path, he would have played 1989 at Elizabethton and maybe the end of the year at Beloit. He would have started 1990 in Beloit, then maybe part of the season in Ft Myers. If he was really good they would have had him in New Britain in 1991 and maybe a shot at the end of the season with the MLB team. So, Knoblauch might have made the Twins at the end of the season he was ROY in. THis was mainly the path Mauer took (Rookie--->A---->A+/AA--->A+/AAA/MLB).

I don't think you realize what you just did there. You negated yourself in exactly the way that those who pay attention have already understood: "Knoblauch moved more quickly than the "modern era" Twins. Kinda like Joe Mauer." ...wait, what?

Not to be a dick, but this whole premise is stupid because you fail to acknowledge the simple and obvious fact that every single player is different.

And that's all there is to it.

Steve J
11-09-2012, 02:57 AM
I don't think Sano and Delmon are comparable. Delmon's minor league OBP was driven largely by a batting average, Sano's by a high walk rate.

mnfanforlife
11-09-2012, 07:30 AM
Lets look at another historical example, Chuck Knoblauch. Drafted in 1989 at the end of the first round he started played 50 games at A- and 20 at A+. In 1990 he was in AA. And in 1991 he was with the Twins.

Following the Twins current conservative path, he would have played 1989 at Elizabethton and maybe the end of the year at Beloit. He would have started 1990 in Beloit, then maybe part of the season in Ft Myers. If he was really good they would have had him in New Britain in 1991 and maybe a shot at the end of the season with the MLB team. So, Knoblauch might have made the Twins at the end of the season he was ROY in. THis was mainly the path Mauer took (Rookie--->A---->A+/AA--->A+/AAA/MLB).

I don't think you realize what you just did there. You negated yourself in exactly the way that those who pay attention have already understood: "Knoblauch moved more quickly than the "modern era" Twins. Kinda like Joe Mauer." ...wait, what?

Not to be a dick, but this whole premise is stupid because you fail to acknowledge the simple and obvious fact that every single player is different.

And that's all there is to it.

This whole premise is a very inelligent, well-thought-out philosphy of teaching baseball to elite prospects at the higher levels faster than the current trend. Good example with Chuck, mlhouse. Maybe Sano isnt as good as Knoblauch was at the same age? Sano certainly wasnt as good as Harper at the same age. But he is an elite prospect, hence the #1 ratings by most lists.

mnfanforlife
11-09-2012, 07:38 AM
I don't think Sano and Delmon are comparable. Delmon's minor league OBP was driven largely by a batting average, Sano's by a high walk rate.

True, Delmon and Sano are as different as can be. But they are similar in that they were signed as teenagers. But, Delmon, being from the U.S.(?), was able to play at higher levels immediately. Whereas Sano is not getting that opportunity (for whatever reason). I can see that Sano strikes out a ton and had a ton of errors and whatever. But so did Plouffe. So did Valencia. So did Bautista. Lets just stop right there with listing Twins 3rd baseman that were crap defensively and couldn't make consistent contact.

mike wants wins
11-09-2012, 08:07 AM
We will know a lot more if Arcia repeats AA.....

Seth Stohs
11-09-2012, 08:08 AM
Lets look at another historical example, Chuck Knoblauch. Drafted in 1989 at the end of the first round he started played 50 games at A- and 20 at A+. In 1990 he was in AA. And in 1991 he was with the Twins.

Following the Twins current conservative path, he would have played 1989 at Elizabethton and maybe the end of the year at Beloit. He would have started 1990 in Beloit, then maybe part of the season in Ft Myers. If he was really good they would have had him in New Britain in 1991 and maybe a shot at the end of the season with the MLB team. So, Knoblauch might have made the Twins at the end of the season he was ROY in. THis was mainly the path Mauer took (Rookie--->A---->A+/AA--->A+/AAA/MLB).

I don't think you realize what you just did there. You negated yourself in exactly the way that those who pay attention have already understood: "Knoblauch moved more quickly than the "modern era" Twins. Kinda like Joe Mauer." ...wait, what?

Not to be a dick, but this whole premise is stupid because you fail to acknowledge the simple and obvious fact that every single player is different.

And that's all there is to it.

This whole premise is a very inelligent, well-thought-out philosphy of teaching baseball to elite prospects at the higher levels faster than the current trend. Good example with Chuck, mlhouse. Maybe Sano isnt as good as Knoblauch was at the same age? Sano certainly wasnt as good as Harper at the same age. But he is an elite prospect, hence the #1 ratings by most lists.

Just a reminder... Knoblauch was a 1st round pick from a big-time college program. The Twins started him at Hi-A, and he played great and moved up to AA quickly...

Levi Michael was a 1st round pick from a big-time college program. The Twins started him at Hi-A... don't you think that if he would have played well, the Twins would have moved him up??

mnfanforlife
11-09-2012, 09:19 AM
Good point Seth. The Michael expample is a good sign that the Twins would start a guy on an accelerated path if they deem the prospect worthy. Levi has either proven unworthy, or that the Florida State league deflates offensive numbers.

mnfanforlife
11-09-2012, 09:25 AM
The problem I have with how they have dealt with Sano/Rosario, is that they were both wayyy too good for a full year in Elizabethton. In my opinion, they both could have skipped (or spent half a season in) ELZ and been getting a taste of full-season schedule in Beloit in 2011. That wouldhave allowed them to break in to an advanced league at A+ towards the end of last year. If they succeeded in A+ last year we could be talking about starting in A+ and putting pressure on the MLB club to vacate 2B and 3B (making way for Rosario/Sano) to start 2014.

mnfanforlife
11-09-2012, 09:41 AM
I can't wait to see what he can do in A+!

markominne
11-09-2012, 10:05 AM
I have been arguing this point for two years now. THe Twins approach to their minor league system is too conservative. A few years ago, when the team was at least a contender for the playoffs it was probably the best approach. But now, as a rebuilding team, it isn't.

Aaron Hicks NEEDS to be the starting OF for the Twins next year. No partial season in AAA. Major league. Same with Gibson in the rotation. Sano and Rosario need to be looked at too during the course of the season. I think the Twins need to keep Joe Benson as a backup OF and see if he can do anything. If the management cannot tell if they are keepers and can be developed they are not doing their jobs and need to be fired. This is our reality going forward.

So, why the hell not? After consecutive 95+ loss seasons they have nothing really to lose. To not do this means that they simply cannot or will not develop young players at the major league level. Listen, this worked in 1982. After a couple of rough years, it paid off. Hrbek(21 years old), Gaetti (22 years old), Puckett(23 years old), Viola(22 years old), Bush, Gagne, and Launder were all players "rushed" from the minors.

Puckett played a short season rookie year, a full season of A+, 21 games at AAA and then to the majors. Viola started in AA, pitched 8 games in AAA the next year before he was called up to the majors. Hrbek played a short rookie year, A-, and A+ when he was called up to the majors. Gaetti short rookie, full A, almost a full year in AA and then late season call up. But, they got to the majors really young, worked out their problems at the major league level, LOST lots of games and but in the end, it all turned out alright.

For those of us pushing for moving prospects into the major leagues faster, I will point out that the 1982 Twins lost 102 games. Plus, when they are losing with these guys, I already can hear the complaining about the "cheap Pohlads" for playing minimum-salary player who should be in the minor leagues. One other thought: While the '82 team was the foundation of tehe '87 world champions, let's not glamorize the 1987 Twins, or lose sight of the fact that they were a severely flawed team with only 2 effective starting pitchers. They caught lightening in a bottle by being in the right division (they won the division with 85 wins), and getting hot at the right time. They took a chance with that core group, and got lucky in '87.

I agree that players who are ready can and should move through the minors quickly. But that is clearly not the case with Sano; 90 errors in the 3 years would make him a 20-year-old DH who struggles to hit breaking pitches.Similarly, someone suggested putting Joe Benson on the 25-man in 2013 "to see what he can do": In 2012 he was demoted early for terrible production, then was injured for most of the remainder of the season. If you recall, he and Parmalee were recalled in 2011, and while Parmalee excelled, Benson looked like a guy snatched out of AA-ball without the tools to play in the major leagues.

Personally, I'll side with Ryan and see if he can pull together a competitive club in 2013 by adding pitching, and give most of these guys at least another year in the minors. Sano is NOT Bryce Harper, and rushing him, Rosaria, Arcia, Benson, et al, onto the major leagues is going to hurt the team in the near term, with no evidence it would help them longer-term.

Who cares how many games the Twins lost in 1982. That is the point. When you are losing, rebuild. After two 95+ loss seasons what players have the Twins developed for the long run? Get the prospects, like Joe Benson, up to the major leagues and see what they can do. From the 1982 team there were several guys who made it and a few that did not, like Dave Engle, Lenny Faedo, and Brad Havens. Rebuilding is a two step process: develop the guys who are good and weed out and replace the guys who are not. By moving early on Lenny Faedo they got Greg Gagne up to replace him. If you move conservatively you will not get that information.

My point is simply that the 1982 rebuild job you're glorifying resulted in a world series championship 5 years later, by a team that was at least as lucky as good. Say what you will, but rushing that great crop of rookies from 1982 that you hold up as an example resulted in exactly 2 winning (and 1 .500) season in 9 years (1982-1990), by the end of which the team had been substantially rebuilt. I don't think you or most of us are going to continue attending games at Target Field for 5 years of losing baseball in the hopes that at the end of that period the Twins might cobble together an 85-win season that might or might not be enough to get them into even the expanded playoffs. In the meantime, many of us will be howling about how the "cheap" Pohlads are playing minor leaguers instead of retaining and buying established major leaguers. Like it or not, the business of baseball requires a competitive team on the field for a team to be viable.

kab21
11-09-2012, 10:19 AM
I think it's silly complaining about Sano's promotions based on a few elite HS #1 overall picks that moved quickly and became stars. He was in full season ball as a teenager and he has some issues. I think the comments that he saw 70% breaking balls is an issue. He still struck out a lot and most pitchers in low A don't have a good breaking ball.

I'm hoping he can take the Giancarlo (Michael) Stanton path and get a promotion to AA next season while being on the radar in 2014 for a promotion. Going that fast will probably mean that 3B is not an option though.

mnfanforlife
11-09-2012, 02:58 PM
Good comparison of Sano to Stanton. Thats probably the best Ive heard yet. Big hitter, dunno what they r gonna b on D

Kwak
11-10-2012, 02:47 PM
I think it's silly complaining about Sano's promotions based on a few elite HS #1 overall picks that moved quickly and became stars. He was in full season ball as a teenager and he has some issues. I think the comments that he saw 70% breaking balls is an issue. He still struck out a lot and most pitchers in low A don't have a good breaking ball.

I'm hoping he can take the Giancarlo (Michael) Stanton path and get a promotion to AA next season while being on the radar in 2014 for a promotion. Going that fast will probably mean that 3B is not an option though.

Ouch! That's a painful reminder to me--Stanton the OF the Twins should have drafted instead of Revere. I favor Sano beginning at Ft. Meyers and hopefully at mid-season earning a promotion to New Britain.

kab21
11-13-2012, 09:15 AM
Ouch! That's a painful reminder to me--Stanton the OF the Twins should have drafted instead of Revere. I favor Sano beginning at Ft. Meyers and hopefully at mid-season earning a promotion to New Britain.

I hope this isn't a hindsight post.

Siehbiscuit
11-13-2012, 09:52 AM
Justin Upton, BJ Upton, Bryce Harper, Mike Trout, Ken Griffey Jr - All of these guys are American-born players that were OUTFIELDERS. Their advantage was not in just understanding the culture, which is a major hurdle, but they are playing defensive positions that allows them to use there athleticism to its fullest. When Miguel Cabrera first came up with the Marlins, he was playing left field. Centerfield is a very important defensive position, but when you have the natural ability to run the way all of these guys I listed, it can cover up some of the technical flaws in their defense.

With Sano, clearly the Twins management thinks he can be a corner infielder. He isn't allowed to just shag fly balls and make sure he is hitting the cutoff man, he is having to work hard on his defense. The time and practice this takes is mentally taxing enough, but add to it the offensive expectations and cultural adjustments.

Sano was 16 when he came to the Twins. Most of us would have been playing our SOPHOMORE seasons of high school ball. Byron Buxton was just drafted and as an 18 year old (only one year younger than Sano), fans and experts alike expect him to spend probably 4 years in the minors before getting a sniff at MLB. The Sano debate is only a debate, because it seems like he has been in our system for awhile. His age is huge to consider. He has tremendous power as we know, but the SKILLS in his game need a lot more than just some tweaking. If Buxton has at least four years to go, can't we wait three more for Sano?

Lastly, if our favorite team was competitive and in the midst of a mid-2000's type of run, would we as fans be pushing for some of our top prospects to be pushed so hard or would we be patient and just wait for them so we could reload instead of rebuild? Elite prospects should be treated correctly and pushed on the timeline that is right for them and REGARDLESS of how the parent club is doing.

mnfanforlife
11-13-2012, 09:59 AM
Yeah I agree it is important for even the most elite prospects to have plenty of seasoning in the minors. But, it would be nice to see some of our guys get pushed out of their comfort zone a bit and see if that helps them develop even faster. In no way do I think Sano was ready for AA ball last year. But I do think his offensive production warranted a look in Ft. Myers to finish the year. Along with Rosario, by the way

jtrinaldi
11-13-2012, 10:41 AM
Watching Sano for the full year this year, I can say that he is the Best Hitter to come through the MWL, since 2009 when Wil Myers was in Burlington, and Mike Trout was in Cedar Rapids. Both Trout and Myers(then a catcher) hit for average, compared to Sano who hit for Power. I have never seen a player that brought people to the ballpark in the MWL like Sano did. Fans knew who Sano was, and on the road, people actually came to the games just to see if he is as advertised. When I was in Lake County, and Fort Wayne in my Beloit gear, I had people coming up to me asking me if Sano was as good as they have been saying he is on the radio. Next years Midwest league class will be Correa/Addison Russell/Almora.

mnfanforlife
11-17-2012, 09:33 AM
While his average isn't a huge deal his swings and misses are a huge deal when talking about moving a guy to the majors. 144 times in low A doesn't cry out ready for the Majors. You didn't even bring up that the guy has no true position in the field and at this point will probably be a RF, DH or 1B guy. 3B is highly dubious. If he can't play 3rd it limits his upside. Byron Buxton is most likely the Twins top prospect and then Sano. We bring up Sano and waste his service time when he's not ready. He isn't close to the prospect Harper is. Not even close. Hopefully Sano will be ready for some big league ball by 2015.

This is exactly why Sano would make such a great beer batter

mnfanforlife
01-16-2013, 05:29 PM
How many K's for Sano in Ft. Myers next year? Homers?

Shane Wahl
01-16-2013, 05:47 PM
How many K's for Sano in Ft. Myers next year? Homers?

80 and 20. He should not be there the full year, in my view. In New Britain, the numbers will be better for him. He ought to be there by mid-July and probably learning first base.

mnfanforlife
01-17-2013, 08:59 AM
80 and 20. He should not be there the full year, in my view. In New Britain, the numbers will be better for him. He ought to be there by mid-July and probably learning first base.

Wow! That's a fresh take on Sano....I just can't see him striking out less than 100 times in a full season. He might hit 30 HR's though. My money is on the Twins keeping Sano/Rosario at A+ all year. I do NOT see either Sano or Rosario moving from their respective postions (at least next year). They need to learn 3B and 2B, and the organization will give them a full year in Florida to do it.

In 2014, they get their first serious audition at New Britain with a chance to be Sept call-ups

Seth Stohs
01-17-2013, 10:40 AM
Wow! That's a fresh take on Sano....I just can't see him striking out less than 100 times in a full season. He might hit 30 HR's though. My money is on the Twins keeping Sano/Rosario at A+ all year. I do NOT see either Sano or Rosario moving from their respective postions (at least next year). They need to learn 3B and 2B, and the organization will give them a full year in Florida to do it.

In 2014, they get their first serious audition at New Britain with a chance to be Sept call-ups

Yeah, there is no chance that Sano (assuming health) strikes out less than 100 times. I'd be shocked! I'm completely comfortable with both of them spending the full season in Ft. Myers.

nicksaviking
01-17-2013, 11:13 AM
If these two continue to produce and improve, I would not be comfortable with them spending an entire year without a promotion. If sticking at 3B and 2B means they absolutely need a full year with the Ft. Myers instructors than I'd fully support an entire season in the FSL. If not, then they need to advance based on their productivity.

FrodaddyG
01-17-2013, 11:33 AM
Yeah, there is no chance that Sano (assuming health) strikes out less than 100 times. I'd be shocked! I'm completely comfortable with both of them spending the full season in Ft. Myers.
I assume he said 80 because the poster thinks he should not be there the full year, and the question he was answering asked for strikeouts at Ft. Myers.

mnfanforlife
01-17-2013, 08:44 PM
I assume he said 80 because the poster thinks he should not be there the full year, and the question he was answering asked for strikeouts at Ft. Myers.

Ahh. Thank you

ThePuck
01-17-2013, 09:44 PM
Delmon is a decent comparison for Sano, but Delmon was pushed through the minors quickly like Harper. Delmon played in AAA at age 19. Sano just finished low-A ball at 19. So that isnt a fair comparison either.

Delmon signed a major league contract when he was drafted, they had no choice but to promote him. Tampa only had 3 option years.

mnfanforlife
01-18-2013, 08:42 AM
Delmon signed a major league contract when he was drafted, they had no choice but to promote him. Tampa only had 3 option years.

that's insane! A high school outfielder gets a major league contract?? Well, Delmon did produce in the minors, and he was probably as ready as he could have been at the time of his promotion. Delmon has regressed so much as an athlete. I really hope Sano can stay in shape and play defense.

My gosh...look at what Delmon did in the South Atlantic League as an 18-yr-old!

ThePuck
01-18-2013, 09:43 AM
that's insane! A high school outfielder gets a major league contract?? Well, Delmon did produce in the minors, and he was probably as ready as he could have been at the time of his promotion. Delmon has regressed so much as an athlete. I really hope Sano can stay in shape and play defense.

My gosh...look at what Delmon did in the South Atlantic League as an 18-yr-old!

Yup, drafted, signed, put right on the 40 man roster. He's not the first guy to sign one, but you're right it's rare.

kab21
01-18-2013, 10:30 AM
Actually it was common for top picks to sign MLB contracts until the last CBA stopped them.

mnfanforlife
01-18-2013, 10:36 AM
Actually it was common for top picks to sign MLB contracts until the last CBA stopped them.

Imagine Buxton in Minnesota's CF as a 20-yr-old. Would not happen...but can you imagine the type of career numbers Buxton could amass with that many potential MLB seasons?

ThePuck
01-18-2013, 11:15 AM
Actually it was common for top picks to sign MLB contracts until the last CBA stopped them.

He didn't say top picks, he was just amazed that an high school player signed a major league contract after being drafted. Was it common for high schoolers to get major league contracts upon being drafted? Cause that's what he was amazed by.

Badsmerf
01-18-2013, 11:48 AM
The only reason Sano spends an entire year in the FSL is to work on defense. The Twins have pushed prospects a little harder once they hit the FSL, so I wouldn't be surprised by a promotion mid-season.

mnfanforlife
01-18-2013, 01:27 PM
He didn't say top picks, he was just amazed that an high school player signed a major league contract after being drafted. Was it common for high schoolers to get major league contracts upon being drafted? Cause that's what he was amazed by.

Exactly

mnfanforlife
01-18-2013, 01:29 PM
The only reason Sano spends an entire year in the FSL is to work on defense. The Twins have pushed prospects a little harder once they hit the FSL, so I wouldn't be surprised by a promotion mid-season.

I sincerely hope Sano AND Rosario get pushed up to AA by the end of 2013