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Cody Christie
08-20-2012, 08:38 AM
There is a little over a month left in the season so, who would you pick for each of the major awards in the National League?

MVP:
Cy Young:
Rookie of the Year:
Manager of the Year:

Pick away and let the debate begin.

Cody Christie
08-20-2012, 08:52 AM
MVP: Andrew McCutchen
Cy Young: Johnny Cueto
Rookie of the Year: Todd Frazier
Manager of the Year: Davey Johnson

DPJ
08-20-2012, 08:54 AM
MVP: McCutchen
Cy Young: Cueto
ROY: Harper
Comeback: Posey (Can't really think of anyone else)
MOY: Hurdle

glanzer
08-20-2012, 11:04 AM
MVP: McCutchen
Cy Young: Dickey
Rookie of the Year: Miley
Manager of the Year: Hurdle

biggentleben
08-20-2012, 06:39 PM
MVP: McCutchen
CY: Kimbrel/Aroldis Chapman pick 'em
ROY: Miley (basically he and Frazier way ahead of anyone else)
MOY: Davey Johnson

DPJ
08-21-2012, 07:19 AM
CY: Kimbrel/Aroldis Chapman pick 'em
ROY: Miley (basically he and Frazier way ahead of anyone else)


How in the hell can you argue that two guys who have throw a combined 105 innings are more valuable then starters who are gonna throw 200+ innings?

Frazier WAR-2.1
Harper WAR-2.0

Way ahead?

biggentleben
08-21-2012, 10:04 AM
CY: Kimbrel/Aroldis Chapman pick 'em
ROY: Miley (basically he and Frazier way ahead of anyone else)


How in the hell can you argue that two guys who have throw a combined 105 innings are more valuable then starters who are gonna throw 200+ innings?

Frazier WAR-2.1
Harper WAR-2.0

Way ahead?

In the absence of a dominant starter, I'll go with one of the two relievers posting historic numbers.

Harper's WAR is drastically influenced by large variances in defensive metrics as is Frazier's. I'll take the value of playing multiple positions and nearly doubling the offensive value (per Fangraphs) of Harper in Frazier's favor.

DPJ
08-22-2012, 05:03 PM
In the absence of a dominant starter, I'll go with one of the two relievers posting historic numbers.

Harper's WAR is drastically influenced by large variances in defensive metrics as is Frazier's. I'll take the value of playing multiple positions and nearly doubling the offensive value (per Fangraphs) of Harper in Frazier's favor.

So you acknowledge advanced stats for Harper and Frazier, but you truly believe two guys who pitch over 100 innings less the starters are somehow more valuable?

biggentleben
08-22-2012, 05:23 PM
In the absence of a dominant starter, I'll go with one of the two relievers posting historic numbers.

Harper's WAR is drastically influenced by large variances in defensive metrics as is Frazier's. I'll take the value of playing multiple positions and nearly doubling the offensive value (per Fangraphs) of Harper in Frazier's favor.

So you acknowledge advanced stats for Harper and Frazier, but you truly believe two guys who pitch over 100 innings less the starters are somehow more valuable?

Yes, because the same metrics that err and create overvaluation for Harper's defense overvalue mediocre innings pitched. I'm not saying that I'd ever vote for a good closer over a good starter, but when two closers are both having historic seasons and no NL starter has even been dominant, there's a good case to be made.

B Richard
08-23-2012, 03:31 PM
MVP: McCutchen
Cy Young: Cueto
Rookie of the Year: Frazier
Manager of the Year: Davey Johnson
Comeback: Beltran

biggentleben
08-23-2012, 03:39 PM
MVP: McCutchen
Cy Young: Cueto
Rookie of the Year: Frazier
Manager of the Year: Davey Johnson
Comeback: Beltran


Um, Beltran had a better season in 2011 than he is in 2012.

B Richard
08-23-2012, 03:45 PM
Um, Beltran had a better season in 2011 than he is in 2012.


...no. I'll just leave this here http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/beltrca01.shtml

Brock Beauchamp
08-23-2012, 03:51 PM
Um, Beltran had a better season in 2011 than he is in 2012.


...no. I'll just leave this here http://www.baseball-reference.com/players. /b/beltrca01.shtml

Looks to me like he was better last season.

J-Dog Dungan
08-23-2012, 04:02 PM
MVP: McCutchen
Cy Young: Dickey fo shizzle; compared to Cueto, has kept hitters to a lower average, has a lower WHIP, has more K's, given up fewer hits, has comparable numbers in walks allowed, has thrown 4 CG's to Cueto's 2, has 2 Shutouts, has been more efficient in pitches thrown even as he has more IP than Cueto, has a lower OBP against, has almost a 2 pt advantage in K/9 innings (9.29-7.16), gives up almost a hit fewer than Cueto in 9 innings, and has almost a point advantage in K's v BB's.
ROY: Either Miley or Frazier (not that Harper wouldn't have been my choice if he had kept up his numbers from when he started)
MOY: Davey Johnson or Clint Hurdle
Comeback: David Wright, Buster Posey, Dickey, or Wainwright

B Richard
08-23-2012, 04:03 PM
Looks to me like he was better last season.

Yeah, you're right. Far be it from me to suggest that an All-Star and current league leader in RBIs is having a worse year than last, during which he only played in 44 games. Maybe the Twins would be better off running out star players once every 4 games. I guess Buster Posey had a better year last year too.

Extrapolate his stats- how was he better last year? I'll take a guy who bats around .280 and produces prolific runs all year over a guy who plays 1/4 of the year. He came back from injury and has contributed greatly to his team's success. QED

Brock Beauchamp
08-23-2012, 04:07 PM
Looks to me like he was better last season.

Yeah, you're right. Far be it from me to suggest that an All-Star and current league leader in RBIs is having a worse year than last, during which he only played in 44 games. Maybe the Twins would be better off running out star players once every 4 games. I guess Buster Posey had a better year last year too.

Extrapolate his stats- how was he better last year? I'll take a guy who bats around .280 and produces prolific runs all year over a guy who plays 1/4 of the year. He came back from injury and has contributed greatly to his team's success. QED

Carlos Beltran played in 142 games last season and posted an OPS+ of 154, a career high.

B Richard
08-23-2012, 04:14 PM
Looks to me like he was better last season.

Yeah, you're right. Far be it from me to suggest that an All-Star and current league leader in RBIs is having a worse year than last, during which he only played in 44 games. Maybe the Twins would be better off running out star players once every 4 games. I guess Buster Posey had a better year last year too.

Extrapolate his stats- how was he better last year? I'll take a guy who bats around .280 and produces prolific runs all year over a guy who plays 1/4 of the year. He came back from injury and has contributed greatly to his team's success. QED

Carlos Beltran played in 142 games last season and posted an OPS+ of 154, a career high.

Ah, my apologies- I misread his BR page and interpreted his time with the Giants as his entire year- forgive my stupidity while I go run some laps outside. For some reason I had it in my head he missed significant time last year with injury

Brock Beauchamp
08-23-2012, 04:17 PM
Ah, my apologies- I misread his BR page and interpreted his time with the Giants as his entire year- forgive my stupidity while I go run some laps outside. For some reason I had it in my head he missed significant time last year with injury

No worries. He missed significant time in both 2009 and 2010. Many had written him off after those seasons.

Ultima Ratio
08-25-2012, 11:52 AM
MVP: Andrew McCutchen
Cy Young: R. A Dickey
Rookie of the Year: Todd Frazier
Manager of the Year: Clint Hurdle