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View Full Version : Ron Gardenhire was not happy...



Parker Hageman
02-21-2012, 03:14 PM
About trading away Jason Bartlett in '07 and not re-signing Nick Punto last year, so says MLB.com reporter and suave Californian Rhett Bollinger (http://bollingerbeat.mlblogs.com/2012/02/21/day-3-of-pitchers-and-catchers-working-out/):


Gardenhire talked about the stability he expects from Jamie Carroll [sp] at shortstop this season. He said he was never in favor of sending Jason Bartlett to the Rays in ’07 in the trade that brought Delmon Young to Minnesota. Also, he added that he wasn’t happy with the decision to not bring back Nick Punto last offseason. But he was happy to see him win the World Series with the Cardinals, and texted him shortly after the Fall Classic to congratulate him.

Knowing Gardy's M.O., that sounds about right.

John Bonnes
02-21-2012, 03:18 PM
I'm a firm believer that Gardenhire and Bill Smith had a terrible relationship. It'll be interesting to see how things go now that Smith is out of the picture.

Mr. Ed
02-21-2012, 03:34 PM
I wonder if Gardy was unhappy trading Garza in that deal.

It seemed to me he was never satisfied with Bartlett's play either, even after he took over following the demotion to AAA for Juanie Castro.

Seth Stohs
02-21-2012, 03:39 PM
I'ts funny because so many thought that Bill Smith might be OK because he was more "administrative" and may not just keep Gardy's guys and agree with what he wanted. I definitely sensed that they didn't have a real close relationship. Sometimes the "Baseball Guys" know best.

gunnarthor
02-21-2012, 04:27 PM
I wonder if Gardy was unhappy trading Garza in that deal.

It seemed to me he was never satisfied with Bartlett's play either, even after he took over following the demotion to AAA for Juanie Castro.

Well, when he did start playing Bartlett, he never stopped playing him. I think Bartlett had worked his way out of any doghouse. Gardy had said a lot of nice things about him after he was installed as the starting short stop.

BK432
02-21-2012, 05:26 PM
Saw this - giggled a bit. Gardy always loved Punto more than the fans did. And you know what? By the middle of last year, I read more than a few 'wish we still had Punto' tweets.

All in all, it will be interesting to see how reuniting Gardy with Ryan will work out. It is clear he clashed quite a bit with Bill smith.

jlichty
02-22-2012, 06:58 AM
I'ts funny because so many thought that Bill Smith might be OK because he was more "administrative" and may not just keep Gardy's guys and agree with what he wanted. I definitely sensed that they didn't have a real close relationship. Sometimes the "Baseball Guys" know best.

All joking aside. Smith's problem was not getting rid of Gardy's guys, but rather having no idea how to replace them with better players or in the case of Hardy, getting rid of a non-gardy guy was the problem.

Trent Condon
02-23-2012, 09:59 AM
Punto was nice to have in a pinch. The problem was him getting 350-450 At bats in a season.

StormJH1
02-23-2012, 10:13 AM
Saw this - giggled a bit. Gardy always loved Punto more than the fans did. And you know what? By the middle of last year, I read more than a few 'wish we still had Punto' tweets.

All in all, it will be interesting to see how reuniting Gardy with Ryan will work out. It is clear he clashed quite a bit with Bill smith.
It's true, but really, what the team needed was ANY MLB-caliber shortstop that could at least field the position with some range. This organization seems to limit themselves to white guys at SS and C, when many of the skilled players at those positions happen to be Latin players. I really don't get it. I don't think there's a conscious discrimination on the Twins part, but it's literally been 20 years without them establishing a long-term relationship with a player at either of those positions that didn't fit the "mold", which is "white, humble, and toolsy". Players like Jose Morales, Wilson Ramos, Orlando Cabrera, Orlando Hudson, and Luis Castillo (the latter two of which are second basemen) got barely a look with us and then were just discarded in favor of the next Butera, Punto, Tolbert, Redmond, Bartlett, Plouffe, and so on.

Look at what Rafael Belliard did as the "Punto" of the Braves for all those teams in the 90's, he was insanely valuable as a defensive replacement.

Yes, Sano is a Latin American prospect and the best prospect in the system, but he won't be a SS either. This organization should be stocked with guys who can at least field the position at the AAA level, but they seem more preoccupied with finding the next Greg Gagne or Brian Harper, and it baffles me.

Nick Nelson
02-23-2012, 10:19 AM
I don't think there's a conscious discrimination on the Twins part, but it's literally been 20 years without them establishing a long-term relationship with a player at either of those positions that didn't fit the "mold", which is "white, humble, and toolsy". Players like Jose Morales, Wilson Ramos, Orlando Cabrera, Orlando Hudson, and Luis Castillo (the latter two of which are second basemen) got barely a look with us and then were just discarded in favor of the next Butera, Punto, Tolbert, Redmond, Bartlett, Plouffe, and so on.

I don't buy this. The Twins haven't really had any long-term fixtures at either of those positions, aside from Pierzynski and Mauer at catcher. I don't think anyone's played more at SS for them over the past 20 years than Cristian Guzman.

spideyo
02-23-2012, 10:58 AM
I don't think it's an issue of race at all. We've hung on to Casilla longer than alot of people think we should of. Jose Morales wasn't a great defensive catcher or much of a bat, Wilson Ramos was still pretty raw behind the plate and more valuable as a trading chip, O-Hud and O-Cab were on the tail end of their careers and essentially "replacement parts". Don't forget we also only gave JJ Hardy a year. And it's hard to argue that the twins should have been investing heavily in Catcher over the last decade when their two starting catchers are likely both Future All-Stars. Last year was really the first awful year for Mauer, and I don't think anyone would have predicted it to be quite that bad

Seth Stohs
02-23-2012, 11:06 AM
In the last 2 years, along with Sano, they have signed Jorge Polanco, Javier Pimentel, Carlos Martinez and some other good middle infielders from Latin America.

mnfireman
02-23-2012, 11:20 AM
Bartlett's play has fallen off and Gardy misused Punto, he should have been a defensive replacement, pinch runner (hold your comments, please!), and twice a week starter at most. I think year 3 of Hardy at SS and year 1 of Carroll at 2B would look like a pretty good IF until Dozier, Michael, etc. are ready to contribute.

Dilligaf69
02-23-2012, 01:13 PM
Not suprising and not really news IMO.