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View Full Version : Article: Minnesota Twins Top 50 Prospects (Part 4: 11-20)



Seth Stohs
05-28-2012, 08:21 PM
You can view the page at http://twinsdaily.com/content.php?591-Minnesota-Twins-Top-50-Prospects-(Part-4-11-20)

shs_59
05-28-2012, 08:43 PM
wow....pretty good job I like this list a lot.

I wish i was as high on Boer as Seth, but unfortunately i am not. And Pedro Florimon at #20 suprised me a bit, does he deserve or fitt in a top 50? Yeah definately but in a top 20-25? i don't know.

I don't see it.

Thrylos
05-28-2012, 08:44 PM
Florimon is interestingly ranked. I think it is probably high given his age and production combination. I think that the Twins did a dis-service to both Michael and Grimes to having them play at least a level higher than they belong. Michael should be in Beloit. Speaking of Beloit, now that I am pretty sure that he will not make your list, you might want to give a second look at Matthew Koch. I really liked what I saw in ST both as far as catching and hitting goes and he reminds me a lot of Chris Herrmann with a tad more power and less discipline and better catch and throw behind the plate. I know he is flying well under the radar, but he will not be for long if he continues like this...

Chance
05-28-2012, 09:23 PM
Thanks for putting in all the work on this Seth! It's a great read and fun to debate. With regards to Michael. Does anyone feel that he fell for a reason and not just the injuries. His college statistics and his pro ball stats thus far don't look that impressive and as a first round pick you would think that he would be extrordinary at something. But he just seems to be average at best in most aspects. I think that Carroll's stats from last year with the dodgers is the most we will ever get out of our first round pick. I thought it was a bad take at the time and still fell that way. There were power arms I would rather have taken. But here's to hoping I'm completely wrong!

Seth Stohs
05-28-2012, 09:30 PM
wow....pretty good job I like this list a lot.

I wish i was as high on Boer as Seth, but unfortunately i am not. And Pedro Florimon at #20 suprised me a bit, does he deserve or fitt in a top 50? Yeah definately but in a top 20-25? i don't know.

I don't see it.

In both of those cases, it might speak to where the farm system is. Boer is about potential, certainly not about the stats he has put up.

Jeremy Nygaard
05-28-2012, 09:37 PM
You might want to give a second look at Matthew Koch. I really liked what I saw in ST both as far as catching and hitting goes and he reminds me a lot of Chris Herrmann with a tad more power and less discipline and better catch and throw behind the plate. I know he is flying well under the radar, but he will not be for long if he continues like this...

I partially agree. When I went down there earlier this year, he was only a name to me. But every time he hit the ball it sounded different than everyone else (except Sano). The problem for Koch - probably not for him as much as how he's regarded as a prospect - is his age. He'd be old for the FSL! Regardless, he's a name to watch.

Seth Stohs
05-28-2012, 09:52 PM
Chance - I am completely unexcited about Michael... Ranking him #15 is actually two spots up from where I had him in my book in January. It's not due to anything he's done. A couple have graduated from the ranks of "prospect" and some injuries as well.

Seth Stohs
05-28-2012, 09:56 PM
I partially agree. When I went down there earlier this year, he was only a name to me. But every time he hit the ball it sounded different than everyone else (except Sano). The problem for Koch - probably not for him as much as how he's regarded as a prospect - is his age. He'd be old for the FSL! Regardless, he's a name to watch.

You're right. Koch (pronounced like "Coach") is plenty old for the level of competition. He had a couple of consecutive big games for the Snappers earlier this month. I have a very hard time ranking catchers because, unless they are a good prospect, they play about every other day. I like the .915 OPS, but 26 K in 77 AB isn't encouraging.

glunn
05-28-2012, 11:47 PM
Thanks for putting in all the work on this Seth! It's a great read and fun to debate. With regards to Michael. Does anyone feel that he fell for a reason and not just the injuries. His college statistics and his pro ball stats thus far don't look that impressive and as a first round pick you would think that he would be extrordinary at something. But he just seems to be average at best in most aspects. I think that Carroll's stats from last year with the dodgers is the most we will ever get out of our first round pick. I thought it was a bad take at the time and still fell that way. There were power arms I would rather have taken. But here's to hoping I'm completely wrong!

I was thinking the same thing. Using a #1 pick for a player with such a low ceiling seems foolish. I wonder if the scouting was flawed or if the Twins were avoiding better players who might want more money.

clutterheart
05-29-2012, 12:00 AM
Koch is 24 years old playing in Low A and didn’t really dominate at E-town. He is a 4 year college player and with his experience we would need to see him against better caliber pitching. At his age he needs to be either dominating Beloit or in High A doing well to be considered a top 50 prospect. At this point Koch is organizational filler whose ceiling is a cup of coffee when is 28. If he gets a mid-season call up to FM, and shows something more than he might get consideration in the 50-40 range.

righty8383
05-29-2012, 12:02 AM
I was thinking the same thing. Using a #1 pick for a player with such a low ceiling seems foolish. I wonder if the scouting was flawed or if the Twins were avoiding better players who might want more money.

Not that I've had a lot of faith in the scouting department these last few years, but to be fair, Michael in the eyes of many national writers was not a bad move. There were several writers including Keith Law that had Michael ranked higher (pre draft) than where the Twins drafted him. That being said, I, like Seth, can't seem to get very excited about him.

Seth Stohs
05-29-2012, 07:28 AM
That's exactly right, and that's what I continue to hope for. The 'draft experts' had him ranked much higher than the 30th spot where the Twins got him. They must have seen something to tell them that he's more than a future utility infielder. From a distance, I don't necessarily see it yet. However, he is quite young for his draft class, did play big time college baseball and succeeded. Obviously need to let him continue to play and hope he improves.

mike wants wins
05-29-2012, 08:42 AM
There are some future MLB players in this part of the list. Not sure what to think about Michael. I wasn't thrilled with the pick when it was made, and so far, well, I'm with Seth, just not that excited by him. Let's hope they figure out what to do with Wimmers' elbow sooner, rather than later. If/when healthy, he's still a legit MLB starting candidate, imo. Boer is the one that I'm bummed on so far. I don't think he'll stay this bad, but I'm bummed on his outcomes so far this year. he and the other recent sandwich and "first round/2nd round" picks at pitcher remind me why I want a pitcher with pick 2....

jmlease1
05-29-2012, 09:29 AM
I'm increasingly leery of the plan for Wimmers. More rehab on an elbow injury for a Twins starter? It's going to really suck if he spends the next 3-4 months rehabbing the injury...and then has to have surgery (Tommy John?) anyways. I hope he's getting second and third opinions.

Seth Stohs
05-29-2012, 09:41 AM
The reports I'm hearing from Ft. Myers are that Wimmers' elbow is not improving at all. I'd guess that they'll make a decision in the next month. Obviously I hope not, and hope that the rehab proves to be the right decision.

Shane Wahl
05-29-2012, 09:43 AM
Koch is 23.5 years old, not 24. Yes, he should be playing in Fort Myers immediately, but when the organization loads in terrible catchers from the top (Butera, Rivera, Towles), one cannot expect proper promotions (Herrmann up one, Rohfing, Pinto up one, Koch up one).

Shane Wahl
05-29-2012, 09:48 AM
Gibson, Bromberg (back now, thankfully), Stuifbergen, and now Wimmers and Salcedo (and Soliman?). It's like a curse. I fear for Hendriks and Hermsen . . .

Mr. Ed
05-29-2012, 10:15 AM
The reports I'm hearing from Ft. Myers are that Wimmers' elbow is not improving at all. I'd guess that they'll make a decision in the next month. Obviously I hope not, and hope that the rehab proves to be the right decision.

Typical Twins. They'll lose Wimmers thru next summer, maybe a month or so.

Don't draft Gioloto(sp), he'll just wind up having TJ surgery too, given the "Twins way" of rest/rehab.

Seth Stohs
05-29-2012, 10:21 AM
Gibson, Bromberg (back now, thankfully), Stuifbergen, and now Wimmers and Salcedo (and Soliman?). It's like a curse. I fear for Hendriks and Hermsen . . .

I just can't help but think that it's just bad luck, right? I mean, I just can't explain it. Bromberg's was totally bad luck. but you're right it's alarming.

Mr. Ed
05-29-2012, 10:27 AM
I just can't help but think that it's just bad luck, right? I mean, I just can't explain it. Bromberg's was totally bad luck. but you're right it's alarming.


Tootle
Bashore
Osterbrock

Among those in the last 4 years also lost to arm surgery and gone now.

YourHouseIsMyHouse
05-29-2012, 10:36 AM
I'm trying to think of who's left.
Gibson
Harrison
Benson
Hicks
Sano
Rosario
Arcia
Boyd
Henriks (If he counts?)
? You got me on this one

Jeff P
05-29-2012, 11:22 AM
I'm trying to think of who's left.
Gibson
Harrison
Benson
Hicks
Sano
Rosario
Arcia
Boyd
Henriks (If he counts?)
? You got me on this one

Parmelee and Dozier are both left, perhaps Parmelee is no longer eligible.

If Boyd is in the top 10, that would be a huge move since Seth ranked him 20th in the preseason (Harrison was 12th so the move is more understandable given the injuries above him).

Jeff

Seth Stohs
05-29-2012, 11:34 AM
Parmelee and Dozier are both left, perhaps Parmelee is no longer eligible.

If Boyd is in the top 10, that would be a huge move since Seth ranked him 20th in the preseason (Harrison was 12th so the move is more understandable given the injuries above him).

Jeff

Dozier is still eligible. Parmelee is over the 130 at bat limit.

gunnarthor
05-29-2012, 11:50 AM
I'm trying to think of who's left.
Gibson
Harrison
Benson
Hicks
Sano
Rosario
Arcia
Boyd
Henriks (If he counts?)
? You got me on this one

Dozier, maybe?

peterb18
05-29-2012, 04:28 PM
I have a little different take on the Michael draft. I'm certainly not happy with him as the #1pick. But, with all of the busts that many early draft picks are, if Michael can duplicate what Carroll has done in his career--3,000 games, .276 batting average, etc., I will be happy. Again, I know Carroll is not a #1 pick, but he is a heck of a player. He is an excellent defender, can bunt well, can hit behind the runner. And he is a complete team player.

Seth Stohs
05-29-2012, 04:51 PM
I agree with that. If you get a player in the first round who has a Jamey Carroll-like numbers at the end of his career, you've made a pretty good pick. That said, we all want Ken Griffey Jr success with our first round picks too, right? :)

Congo Hammer
05-29-2012, 06:30 PM
Again, I know Carroll is not a #1 pick, but he is a heck of a player. He is an excellent defender, can bunt well, can hit behind the runner. And he is a complete team player.


peterb18---

You have fallen into the "THE TWINS WAY" trap! We don't need more players who can bunt, hit behind the runner, be a team player or any of that other Stanford boolah-boolah (tip of the cap to Tom Kelly for that one) thinking.

The Twins need batters that can hit, hopefully by pulling the ball and pitchers that can avoid impact with the opposing batter's bat.

peterb18
05-29-2012, 08:24 PM
No, Congo Hammer that comment was meant specifically for the Michael pick. We are all aware that draft picks should be highly talented--power arms, strong hitters, elite athletes , etc. We all want that! But, every team needs Jamie Carroll type players--good baseball players to fill out a roster.
Seth's comment is right on!!

USAFChief
05-29-2012, 10:06 PM
No, Congo Hammer that comment was meant specifically for the Michael pick. We are all aware that draft picks should be highly talented--power arms, strong hitters, elite athletes , etc. We all want that! But, every team needs Jamie Carroll type players--good baseball players to fill out a roster.
Seth's comment is right on!!

Jamie Carroll type players are what you settle for when you don't have better ones. And they are available pretty cheaply pretty much every offseason.

Seth Stohs
05-29-2012, 10:23 PM
What we're saying is that most 1st round picks dont' have the career that Jamey Carroll has had, at least most taken in the late first round which is where Michael was drafted. Obviously you're trying to find an All-Star with every pick, but that's not realistic.

PMKI
05-29-2012, 11:54 PM
Do you think we will see Florimon this season? Anyone else on this list we could see this season?