• Is The Window Open For Another Twins Trade?

    The Minnesota Twins’ offseason has been interesting to say the least.

    With the team trading away not one but two of their major league ready center fielders, the writing on the wall at 1 Twins Way appears to read that the focus is on the future. Outwardly, the Twins are sending the message that they are doing what they can to build a competitive team in 2013 but also taking measures to fortify the club for the coming years. Behind closed doors however, the tone may be different as the reality is that the organization recognizes the window for success begins at least one year down the road.

    And this may be the reason why Justin Morneau could be traded yet this offseason.

    During the winter meetings, the Twins were reported to have been “gauging interest” from other teams on what they would give for Morneau. Obviously nothing materialized at the time and, furthermore, the Twins may have simply been testing the waters rather than outright shopping their first baseman. That said, as the team made abundantly clear after last season, no one is untradeable.

    The conditions were not favorable at the time of baseball’s annual agent orgy, at least not for the first base market. Had someone like the Orioles offered up a top flight arm, Morneau may already be eating Maryland crab cakes. Instead, teams were still addressing other needs. Targeting vital up-the-middle position players. Trying to land top-of-the-rotation arms. The game’s top free agents had yet to sign. The dominoes were still mostly intact.

    That changed yesterday when Angels signed outfielder Josh Hamilton out from under the Texas Rangers’ nose. Not only did the Rangers lose a talented player to their division rival, they also became fairly exposed from the left-side of the plate.

    Because of that, it may not be long before the Rangers call on Morneau and ask: “How much?”

    Aside from losing Hamilton’s production from the left side, they also have lost their designated hitter in Young. Potentially desperate to address those needs, Rangers’ GM Jon Daniels may be inquiring on Morneau soon. With the Angels launching themselves into the catbird seat of the AL West and the surprising and youthful Oakland A’s extremely competitive as well, Daniels will surely need to counteract what his rivals have done this winter.

    From the Rangers’ perspective, targeting Morneau makes plenty of sense. In spite of witnessing a decline in his home run totals in recent years, a new venue could help rejuvenate the Canadian slugger. The Ballpark at Arlington is one of the most favorable environments for left-handed hitters to play. According to StatCorner.com’s Park Factors, Texas’s stadium has a home run factor of 117 (anything over 100 favors hitters). By comparison, Target Field’s confines thwart that type of power production to the tune of 78. In theory, Morneau’s numbers would be enhanced significantly with the Rangers.

    Additionally, with one year left on his contract, it would be a relatively risk-free (minus the concussion, of course) deal for Texas.

    Under most circumstances, the idea of asking a team to absorb $14M for a 31-year-old with injury issues may be a tall task, however, Texas is one of a few teams who seem able to assume the risk. The Rangers, who have lost Hamilton’s previous contract ($15.25M), Mike Napoli’s ($9.4M) and a portion of Michael Young’s ($5.5M of his total $16M owed), have payroll space to add Morneau’s contract if they so choose. As it stands, they have roughly $50M committed to players (pre-arbitration contracts, of course) after reached $120M in 2012. After all, in addition to whatever revenue they generate for being one of the best attended teams in the American League (2 of 14), they also have approximately $80 million a year coming in from their TV deal with Fox Sports Southwest.

    On the other hand, by most measures, the Rangers are a smart team. Daniels has been one of the most impressive general managers in the game – building his organization from the ground up, emphasizing scouting, bringing in elite international talent and targeting quality free agents. After making several moves to acquire players like Cliff Lee and Ryan Dempster in recent years, he has also lost some notable prospect talent so it is hard to envision the Rangers sacrificing much in any deal.

    Likewise, the overall market for Morneau was lukewarm at best at the deadline last year. Even losing a star player to a division opponent may not be enough to inspire Daniels to surrender the young pitching the Twins are hoping for.

    Would Morneau make the Twins better in 2013? Yes. Would trading him upset the fan base? Of course. Is he untouchable? Obviously not. The Twins sent the message at the winter meeting that Morneau could be had for a price, not it appears that the Rangers maybe in a position where they might have to pay that.
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    This article was originally published in blog: Is The Window Open For Another Twins Trade? started by Parker Hageman
    Comments 66 Comments
    1. eveldrive's Avatar
      eveldrive -
      I for one am tiring of the Twins always conservative approach, picking up pitchers like Correia and last year Marquis. For once I would like to see a move that excites the fan base - a move that is risky and out of character, but has high upside. Go for an Edwin Jackson; or pull off a trade like KC just did. The overall approach of building through the farm system is good, but occasionally it would just be fun to "go for it".
    1. gunnarthor's Avatar
      gunnarthor -
      Obviously, it depends on the offer but I think the Twins would be better served by having Morneau play here at first. If, at the break, we're 14 GB but Morneau is putting up a .290/.365/.480 136 OPS+ type season, his trade value will be much greater. Especially if someone (Rangers, Pirates, Nats) feel that they need a LH power bat due to injuries or ineffective play.

      Plus, the fans love Morneau. Ryan can't just trade him for salary relief. He'd need something great in return.
    1. jokin's Avatar
      jokin -
      Quote Originally Posted by mike wants wins View Post
      What is the point of getting Andrus if you do not sign 2 legit pitchers? Either try to win, or rebuild.
      He has very decent in-demand value. He could possibly get you one of those pitchers, not for 2013, but for down the road when it really matters.
    1. Brandon's Avatar
      Brandon -
      If they trade Morneau to the Rangers its gonna be for prospects in A ball. Olt would be the lone exception as he is bloked the next few years. A trade of Morneau would signal a youth movement is all out as now there would be 3 rookies in the lineup at 1B (well Parmalee is almost still a rookie), RF, and CF and i guess SS as I think Florimon is a rookie. If we get Olt i guess Plouffe could move to 1B or RF so we aren't rushing anyone from the minors.

      I do the the minor league SS is intriging. Sardinez or something.
    1. gunnarthor's Avatar
      gunnarthor -
      Quote Originally Posted by eveldrive View Post
      For once I would like to see a move that excites the fan base - a move that is risky and out of character, but has high upside. The overall approach of building through the farm system is good, but occasionally it would just be fun to "go for it".
      Hey, Bill Smith did that. Traded Garza for a Young and Ramos in a win-now trade.
    1. mike wants wins's Avatar
      mike wants wins -
      Why does 2013 not matter? And why not trade for young guys now? If he is in demand, do a three way. The longer you wait to trade for young guys, the longer before they are up.
    1. jokin's Avatar
      jokin -
      Quote Originally Posted by mike wants wins View Post
      Why does 2013 not matter? And why not trade for young guys now? If he is in demand, do a three way. The longer you wait to trade for young guys, the longer before they are up.
      It doesn't matter to the Twins ( this is self-evident by looking at what they do, not what they say) or they would be willing to do the things that other clubs are doing to improve themselves right now.
    1. Willihammer's Avatar
      Willihammer -
      I don't see how Morneau is much of an upgrade over Mitch Moreland
    1. beckmt's Avatar
      beckmt -
      This would be more likely to happen at the trade deadline next year. Morneau has better landing places than Texas for return. (Tampa, Seattle, Boston) for a few.
    1. aboveaveragejoe's Avatar
      aboveaveragejoe -
      If the Twins can get a top 50 prospect or even two top 100 prospects for Morneau now or at the trade deadline they should pull the trigger. However, if there isn't this level of interest in him I suggest they hold on to him for two reasons. 1 - keep a competitive team (as much as possible in the current situation) to keep fan interest in the team. 2 - Give him a 1 year qualifying offer after the season (roughly 13 million) and if he signs a multi year deal else where the Twins still get a high draft pick for him. If he takes the offer, the Twins have one more year with little risk while they start bringing up the young talent from the minors and see where the team stands before deciding on Morneau's future in MN.
    1. mike wants wins's Avatar
      mike wants wins -
      Let's just be honest, they are not even trying to be competitive. Just trade him and pocket the money and be honest about who you really are....
    1. weinshie's Avatar
      weinshie -
      I would think the Rangers would have much more interest in Mauer: they need a pure hitter who can catch and play 1b. And Mauer might net Profar and a SP prospect. I love Joe Baseball, but let's be honest, he's injury prone and, at Target Field, he's got little power; his defensive skills have already eroded (you can run on him now) and his contract is an albatross to a rebuilding team.

      Curious to hear what other fans think of letting Joe go....
    1. CDog's Avatar
      CDog -
      Quote Originally Posted by weinshie View Post
      Curious to hear what other fans think of letting Joe go....
      There are about a million threads (number approximated) either completely devoted to the topic or at least touching on it via tangents. So you can find out fairly easily.
    1. kryptik's Avatar
      kryptik -
      My feeling is Morneau and Willingham are both going to be moved before next trade deadline.

      Willingham probably moves first because his contract is great and his numbers aren't in all likelihood going to get better, his value is as high as it is going to be.

      TR will wait on pulling the trigger on a Morneau deal until the deadline I bet, doesn't want to alienate fans the first half of the season. If we are losing Target Field won't have a lot of fans for the 2nd half anyway so the negative PR of trading away Morneau will be muted.

      I think we'll be lucky to stay below 90 losses next year but hopefully we can continue to draft well and keep building the system.
    1. Rosterman's Avatar
      Rosterman -
      Willingham is an attractive chip/ If he can come out of the gate pulling his average stats, he'll be a wonderful trading chip because of the 2014 contract remains.

      You have to ask these questions on Morneau:

      Can Parmelee play first as well and put up respectble numbers. If Parmlee moves to first, who plays in right.

      If you do trade Willingham, you are stacking the outfield with three prospects now who will learn on the job. Good or bad.

      Morneau being traded this winter does free up salary. What do you do with this salary.

      Trading Morneau (and possibly Willingham later) screws up he line-up. Would Mauer be the first guy to walk 500 times in a season. Does he become the first to swing at an intentional walk pitch and homer?

      Morneau is more valuable to a team now, because if he has a halfway decent season (not a super season) they can offer him a contract and keep him or get a prospect in return. That could be a possibility. If they trade for him mid-season, the lost that control.

      Is there anyway the Twin front office would consider signing Morneau for a 2-3 extension and at what price, right now, today. $7 million a year? $10 million a year. A 2-year plus a third option? Again, would that money be better spent elsewhere and we forget about Parmelee in the longterm and leave him to smoulder-out in right. Would that money be spent elsewhere on something more rewarding to the team.

      The Twins are in a mess. They can throw money at players and still come in last place in the division. Maybe not lose 90 games, but still look up from the downside.

      As fans, we look at three things:

      Prospects can be fun and exciting to watch play, but they can flame out or shine. You don't know until you see them play. Do you bring guys up "before they might be ready" or let them get extensive seasoning.

      If you have $100 million, are you expected to spend it. Because sure don't see it being held over and overspent in a future season. And what is it spent on...more prospects, aging veterans, overpaying nothingness. Man, let's make the Twins open a savings account...at some bank other than Marquette.

      At some point, no one is untouchable. Mauer is the hometown kid, but he IS a liability. He's a light slugging/high average catcher who may not be catching half the games as his time wears on. As a catcher, he is extremely valuable. As a 1B he is Doug Mientkiewicz. As a third baseman
      he is...no one knows. As a DH he is Paul Molitor light. Morneau COULD have health issues, or he just becomes another team favorite going elsewhere. We cried about no Cuddyer and Nathan last year. Hell, we keep Morneau and then he declares free agency and signs for someone at a bargain rate in 2014 and we cry foul. A new favorite will come along. If you lose with the oldtimers, you'll lose with the new kids.

      If the Twins go into rebuilding mode, is it still to late to deep-six Gardy and Anderson and just start over?
    1. Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
      Brock Beauchamp -
      Quote Originally Posted by Rosterman View Post
      At some point, no one is untouchable. Mauer is the hometown kid, but he IS a liability. He's a light slugging/high average catcher who may not be catching half the games as his time wears on. As a catcher, he is extremely valuable. As a 1B he is Doug Mientkiewicz. As a third baseman he is...no one knows. As a DH he is Paul Molitor light.
      Dude, you are seriously underselling Mauer's ability. "Doug Mientkiewicz"? "Paul Molitor light"?

      Mientkiewicz had two seasons that were almost as good as Mauer's 2012, which was a slight disappointment compared to previous seasons and you could see Joe struggling to get his legs under him early in the season and then peaking as the season progressed.

      Molitor had an OBP of over .400 three times in his career. Mauer has already done it five times and he's not even 30 yet. I'd say that Molitor is a pretty good comp for Mauer with Joe being the better OBP guy and Molitor slugging higher. Overall, right now their careers are pretty similar, though Paul seemed to keep getting better with age. We'll see how Joe does in his early 30s. Either way, you could make the argument that Joe is the better hitter than Paul... and he's certainly not "Paul Molitor light".

      It baffles me how Twins fans continually underestimate just how ****ing good Joe Mauer is at the game of baseball. He's in "top five hitting catchers of all time" territory. What do some of you expect from the poor guy? Water into wine? Walking on water?
    1. CDog's Avatar
      CDog -
      Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
      Dude, you are seriously underselling Mauer's ability. "Doug Mientkiewicz"? "Paul Molitor light"?

      Mientkiewicz had two seasons that were almost as good as Mauer's 2012, which was a slight disappointment compared to previous seasons and you could see Joe struggling to get his legs under him early in the season and then peaking as the season progressed.

      Molitor had an OBP of over .400 three times in his career. Mauer has already done it five times and he's not even 30 yet. I'd say that Molitor is a pretty good comp for Mauer with Joe being the better OBP guy and Molitor slugging higher. Overall, right now their careers are pretty similar, though Paul seemed to keep getting better with age. We'll see how Joe does in his early 30s. Either way, you could make the argument that Joe is the better hitter than Paul... and he's certainly not "Paul Molitor light".

      It baffles me how Twins fans continually underestimate just how ****ing good Joe Mauer is at the game of baseball. He's in "top five hitting catchers of all time" territory. What do some of you expect from the poor guy? Water into wine? Walking on water?
      I thought maybe I was mis-remembering how well Mientkiewicz hit, so I went and looked. I spent most of the time just shaking my head in wonder, while thinking essentially the words that Brock wrote here.
    1. Shane Wahl's Avatar
      Shane Wahl -
      Absolutely trade him now or at the deadline. The Rangers are a good fit, but they might be cautious about handing Profar the SS job by trading Elvis away. They might make more sense at the deadline. Of course, if they would willing to part with Olt, then take it.
    1. Shane Wahl's Avatar
      Shane Wahl -
      Isn't the most apt Mauer-as-1B comparison John Olerud? By far?
    1. Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
      Brock Beauchamp -
      Quote Originally Posted by Shane Wahl View Post
      Isn't the most apt Mauer-as-1B comparison John Olerud? By far?
      That'd be my choice though Mauer is a slightly better average guy and slightly down in slugging.
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